unkle spike Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 Any time you have a square you have stress points at the corners. I see the merit in your idea. May not have been the first in the recorded history of blacksmithing, but the first I had heard or thought about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 Saying your idea is so good that other folks have come up with it before is not trivializing it in my book. OTOH not wanting to use a term that has been used for well over a century in the business for "trivial" reasons seems odd to me. Sort of like victorians who would put "trousers" over piano "legs" so as to not offend... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 When you think the problem through you can see that there are good reasons for the LG hammer to have a square "tupp" in the era in which it was first built. When you think of the tire hammer's history you can understand why it started square. Given the size, application, and era of the tire hammer, using a round "tupp" is excellent economy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divermike Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 round tire hammer section idea... good history ....good senseless back and forth, commenting that hurts feelings... bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unkle spike Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 I googled "tupping" :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GobblerForge Posted May 14, 2009 Author Share Posted May 14, 2009 After rereading posts, I think I have to clear some stuff that maybe some of you folks don't know. Thomas used to live here in Ohio and we have met and talked on many occasions at quad state back to probably early 90's. I think first time we met was at Emert's and he was making a billet out of band saw blades and introduced me to the concept of damascus. Can you remember back that far Thomas? Any way, I was not offended by him and don't feel he was being offencive. The "trivializing" statement was directed at the statement that this is nothing new. Fact is I have been to Europe 7 times and have been in many shops and have seen many hammers. Nary a one was round. And yes I know that not all anvils are one horned. Gobbler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 Well, I don't recall anyone named Gobbler way back then; but I'm nortoriously bad wrt names---why I wear the disreputable red hat. I don't expect folks to remember my name---but they remember the hat! I still use Thomas though. I'm very happy you weren't crushed by my unfeeling replies. I sure miss Emmert's place. My first Quad-State there I was in my sleeping bag in my tent and it was after 10pm and I could hear *4* triphammers running; 25#'r going ping ping ping ping; a 50#'r going thud thud, a 100#'r going WHOMP WHOMP and an air hammer going unhhhhhh-thwap unhhhhhh-thwap unhhhhhh-thwap... Did you get a chance to see any working schwanze hammers in Germany? I think what I was trying to convey is that what is normal to us is not necessarily normal in the scheme of the entire world. In Germany a single horned anvil is the oddball where in America the double horned is unusual. (though not as unusual as it was almost 30 years ago when I got started.) Most of the luft hammers I have seen were round shafted and I have seen at least two mechanical ones that were and owned one of them. Bought from an old oilfield weldor in OK for $250, sold it when I moved to OH and had to pay almost 3 times that to buy a champion #0. So lets drop this and get on to the interesting parts like how are you keeping the dies indexed? gibs in slots on the top ram? Index off the pitman-ram joint? Grits and red eye gravy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GobblerForge Posted May 15, 2009 Author Share Posted May 15, 2009 As far as indexing, there is no rotating by the hammer. It stays in line. Remember, it is under a little preasure from the spring perpendicular to the axis of the offset axil. It wants to stay strait. My bottom dies are oriented to the hammer and nothing moves. And about Emert's, I miss the cannon and the teepees. Gobbler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 15, 2009 Share Posted May 15, 2009 I'd worry about "throw" if you are doing out of balance forging on a set of dies---like combo dies where you may work on one side or the other but not the middle where the dies change. Twisting force has to go somewhere and will probably be the pitman tup joint. No problem if sized for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerkid Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 Thats the design i`am going BUILD!!! I got all the parts , besides getting the motor and the spare tire, and the coil spring and I have a freind who said he`d turn me the thing that goes on the motor taht turns the tire for free. My ram will also be round, the guide will be out of pipe though. Thanks for the tips and such Gobbler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerkid Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 (edited) I'd worry about "throw" if you are doing out of balance forging on a set of dies---like combo dies where you may work on one side or the other but not the middle where the dies change. Twisting force has to go somewhere and will probably be the pitman tup joint. No problem if sized for it. Thomas, How big would it need to be? Also Gobbler, How long is the coil spring you used? and how thick are the coils? would 5/8" work? Edited June 17, 2009 by hammerkid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 Without engineering the entire system all I can say is "big enough". I have a bad tendency to over engineer stuff I build anyway---I once built a tent frame that on a bet we hung a porch swing on and had 500# of people sitting on it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerkid Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 LOL sounds like my cosuin LOL. Think going scale my ram down to 2 1/2" sq. solid cause other wise my ration would be all the HECK , it still won t be best ration but much better . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerkid Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 Gobbler, How big is the shaft on the motor thats the "drive pulley" is on , also is the drive pulley got a set screw throw it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GobblerForge Posted June 24, 2009 Author Share Posted June 24, 2009 Hammerkid. The motor shaft is 1" or so only because that is what I had. Any size will work. The motor itself is 1/3HP. If your friend is making the pulley, then he can make it to what ever size you want. That's handy. My pulley is 2 3/4". Then it just needs the key slot cut. Yes there is a set screw in mine in line with the key. The spring is 8 inches long with 1/2" coil stock and is compressed to 7 1/2" I'm sure your 5/8" coil will work fine. The vertical arms don't come together very far as the hammer is working. Only a quarter or half inch or so. It's impressive as to how little everything actually moves in relation to how much the hammer does. Gobbler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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