Steve Sells Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 (edited) [markb] hey whats up with the abs and other groups [steve sells] This weekend the ABS is having the East KNife show in Atlanta Rich Hale has a table there [Finnr] Hope he does well. He has been trying to get into that show for quite a while [steve sells] hard to get in, as ABS is so clique, in most cases non members aint welcome, I have been told too many times so I gave up trying to talk to them, mostly [Finnr] Don't start Jim on them [markb] you gotta know someone to get in? [steve sells] even had One member tell me I should not be making Damascus because I dont have a ABS JS stamp yet, then on the other hand People like Kevin Cashen are ABS masters, and great to talk too, very respectful and helpful toall. [Finnr] I ain't got an apprentice stamp. I make it! [steve sells] 10:08 pm: I can join, but one local person told me I have to pay the member ship AND atend their week long Beginner class ?he never even looked at my blades... but decided I have to pay for a week long Beginner smighing class way down south >? its nuts, I refused, so the phone call ended. [steve sells] ok People, Welcome to the Friday night Knife chat at I Forge Iron What do we wish to cover tonight ? [Finnr] There was some interesting cablemascus talk in the forum [steve sells] wanna cover cable welding ? [brucegodlesky] cable is fun stuff:-) [Finnr] I'm easy, (cheaptoo ) [markb] lets go [fat pete] ever have a hard time keeping a knife straight [brucegodlesky] when it goes good , it is great [Finnr] as in warping in HT? [brucegodlesky] I made up 2 sets of BBQ tools this week from it [brucegodlesky] no Steve, as in welding [steve sells] ok Bruce wanna stat telling us how to get going ? [Finnr] I need to pick up some cable [steve sells] me too Fat pete said something about bringing some here next month [brucegodlesky] I start by electric welding the ends of each piece [fat pete] have one i have been messing with and i heat it up i use cedar hammer and wack out the wammy and stick it in lime and the wammy is there when it cools [brucegodlesky] get it hot and beat it on the anvil to clean out all the grase and junk [fat pete] 10:14 pm: i dont have a weldr [brucegodlesky] Then forge weld the ends first. Wrap the ends with wire first [Finnr] You untwist at all to flux Bruce? [fat pete] just like a pattern weld [brucegodlesky] after the ends are welded, untwist and flux [Finnr] OK [brucegodlesky] Then get 'er hot [steve sells] you use your anvil face? or a v swage? [brucegodlesky] When you think it's hot enuff, wait 5 more minutes, not yet Steve. I have a pipe vise mounted on the bench and put one end in there and twist with a pipe wrench, Twisting mebbe 3-4 inches at a time [steve sells] ok [brucegodlesky] Then go back and do it again. [fat pete] how long is the piece you are starting with [brucegodlesky] You'll feel it weld right up solid oh, anywhere from a foot to 2 feet [brucegodlesky] I been using 1 1/4" cable lately I like to have a young guy around to help with hte twisting [Finnr] Lets me out. LOL [fat pete] so you really wanna crank down on it [steve sells] finnr did you sell off yer apprentices? [brucegodlesky] Ya but not twist it off [Finnr] Had too they ate too much! [markb] so the twisting is making the weld? [steve sells] i have pipe vise mod's I built for my band saaw, but never got arouns to making them for the legt vise... [brucegodlesky] : After it's welded on the twist, take it to the anvil and hammwer in the direction of the twist. All them lil wickers will weld to the billet. [brucegodlesky] The twisting welds the inside material [Finnr]Got a machinists vise with pipe jaws on it [brucegodlesky] I pretty much follow Dr Jim's directions. [Finnr] He's a REAL bad influence. LOL [brucegodlesky]Tried it with a V swedge and couldn't get it to weld right [fat pete] : who dat [brucegodlesky] : Ya he is [brucegodlesky] JPH, he's in often [Finnr] got me trying a composite [brucegodlesky] I also tried taking it right to the hammer after twisting and didn't get goos welds [brucegodlesky] good welds [fat pete] composit handle materiel [markb] Any folding for pattern? [Finnr] Best luck ihave had is in a round groove in my block Composite blade Pete [brucegodlesky] Once it's welded, then ya can stretch it out and fold I've thought that would work well Finnr [fat pete] like carbon fiber or somethin [Finnr] Ancient Norse style Pattern weld [brucegodlesky] But I don't have a block yet [brucegodlesky] I made 2 sets of BBQ tools from about a foot of cable They aere about $75 right? [Finnr] Saltfork Craftsmen, sell real nice blocks [Finnr] Up a bit now mine was 111 a couple years back [steve sells] I was too cheap to pony up and buy a nice swege so I got a block of tool steel and using the mill.... [Finnr] Saltfork Craftsmen [JJ] I have two client6s coming over sunday wanting to order fillet knives for combination fish/abalone, plus oyster knives. [brucegodlesky] I think that would work very well [steve sells] thank you [steve sells] reasonable priced too [brucegodlesky] IIRC, Sweany uses a swedge made fronm a piece of angle [steve sells] but not the shapes I want at a knife /sword maker [fat pete] its a good price [JJ] i developed a system to use tree limbs for swages using a hardy t3neon, drilled and bolted to a 1/8" x 1" strap. they are really nice. [Finnr] Yep even with shipping [steve sells] so I make my own to size/shape, hammering out the hfurnature for sword scabbards, need speical things [Finnr] My first swage block was a short hunkof RR rail [steve sells] Bruce for cable, I welded up some heavy duty angle Iron and added a hardy stump [brucegodlesky] that'll work [steve sells] 6 inches long 2inch sides [brucegodlesky] 1 just have to keep everything gathered together [Finnr] every time I get it together I forget where I put it? [JJ] i use opened out, half-round bottom swages for gang forge welds. [brucegodlesky] main thing is keep it all hot [steve sells] I will have to try Bruce methiod of twisting like craxy are welding temp before hammering [Finnr] I was just saying JJ that I use the half rounds in my SF block for cable welds [brucegodlesky] I had a cable blade last wek that wouldn't harden [steve sells] some cane be less carbon , BUT I have toi ask did you thermal cycle it a lot ? [brucegodlesky] 3 times in the quench and still sodft [steve sells] TOO many cycles can reduce hardenability [brucegodlesky] yes I did [steve sells]ok 3 aint too much LOL [JJ] distracted here with stir-fry with raspberry/chipolte sauce [brucegodlesky] Give it to my cousin to fool with in his oven. Finally got it to harden in water [steve sells] but there is a report at another site, whee they tested a few, and 12 cycles lowered too much to harden a 1080, the test was by HOward Clarke I think [brucegodlesky] brand new cable too I heard him talk about that before [steve sells] on the other hand a grain size of 3 can probably only be acheived by someone LIKE howard [steve sells] for most of us,. 10 or less is great [JJ] 10:40 pm: 3, 10,wh at? microns? [steve sells] I never had mine teasted, the munbers I use only for referance in reading reports... [Finnr]We good. He's gooder! [steve sells] microns I think [brucegodlesky] I have 2 more billets of that stuff and don't know if I'll fool with them. might just turn them into bs items [JJ] bruce, turn them into jewelery...lot of money there. [steve sells] IF your cable is just old standard grade lpow share, and not newex X or XX inproved., its close to 1065 [brucegodlesky] that's an idea too [brucegodlesky] this come of a respool job on a dragline [JJ] 10:41 pm: for jewelery, 1 cu in is good for $300 [steve sells] add too many thermal cycles refining the grain very small, and I can see it needing water or Brine to harden, Nothing wrong with that, I bet that bvlade would stand a LOT of abuse before it broke, thats a good thing [brucegodlesky] I'll get it back this week to regrind [steve sells] get it back ? [brucegodlesky] ther blade [JJ] from cousin [brucegodlesky]that wouldn't harden [JJ] : any you guys ever made an oyster opening knife? [steve sells] not a lot of Oysters in Indiana JJ [fat pete] lots around here [brucegodlesky] there are some in the rivers here [JJ] need to be about 3" long by 1 1/8" wide, good belly shape...not shave sharp, but MUST hold edge against shell cutting to open. and lots of hard sideways prying on the blade. [brucegodlesky]why JJ? [markb] Had one marked will&finck once [brucegodlesky] : mid 50's?? [steve sells] I hav eused them, never made one [markb] Kid got a hold of it and lost it [brucegodlesky] RC [JJ] Bruce, i have 2 clidnts coming over sunday, for fillet/oyster knife orders. [brucegodlesky] what steel ya using [steve sells] I do have an order for pattern weld Fillet, I will use O-1 and L-6 Edited June 9, 2009 by mod07 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted June 8, 2009 Author Share Posted June 8, 2009 [steve sells] simple twist [JJ] don't think mid 50's will hold an edge against cutting into oyster shell...that's one of my qu4estions... [steve sells] D-2 would hold up well for same reasons we choose that for the garden Hoe [lobodag] L-6 rusts to easy [markb] They arn't sharp just a pry bar [brucegodlesky] what about the twisting action? [JJ] last 2 knives i finished were [JJ] d-2 [steve sells] strength, and wont get worn away Rather you than ME jj dont like the High Chrome steels much not that I dont have respect things made from it, I just don't like to work them [JJ] i can get a 61 Rc on D-2 out of my gas forge. so i don't mind working it. would not want to if i did not have the 100 lb power hammer. [Finnr] Tungsten :whistle: [steve sells] Bad Finnr LOL [Finnr]LOL!!! [steve sells] Go sit on that Rock in the corner [markb] The soft one [steve sells] and dont get yourself cut on the sword sticking out from it [Finnr] One with a sord in it? [Finnr] Glenn closed that thread! LOL [markb] Don't tell [steve sells] but Glenn getst to kill the best ones LOL [Finnr] Some are that bad Huh? [steve sells] but I get blamed for it by a few people in the forum. [JJ] anyone know what an "electron beam" weld is? [fat pete] lol [JJ] Bruce, i never saw a pic of any of your blades...got a website? [brucegodlesky] BirdogForge.com it's under construction but have some stuff on there [steve sells] anyway weather allowed me ot forge again so I finaly habve the PRoject knife geting ready [brucegodlesky] I just finished a month of turkey hunting so missed a lotof things [JJ] Bruce, i too am a dog lover. getting a new puppy this sunday matter of fact. [Finnr] Vice stuff Bruce [brucegodlesky] what brand? thanks Finnr [steve sells]to help one of my apprentices, we ground that last failed blade and at 45 Micron we could see spider web crack half inch long and ONLY on one side [Finnr] Nice stuff * [JJ] german shephard crossed with border collie...all brown color with faint black highlights. [markb] What caused that [steve sells] we did it to show him WHY i gave up after I heard a crack sound when cooling, [markb] How many slaves you got [steve sells]I let it rest on anvil after forging while I refilled my coffee. and heard THAT sound [Finnr] Bad sound!! [steve sells] I own 3 apprentices, only one works regularly [brucegodlesky] TINK!!!! [JJ] oh, man! the steel heat sink syndrome. [brucegodlesky] I'm down to 2 dogs now JJ [markb] I haven't heard that yet oh well my time is coming [steve sells] dong, mid 30's 5 yrs app, Chris (A member here but has not posted) is 15 yr, 3yr app, and my 13 yr old son [Finnr] Almost as bad as when the Dr says OOPS!!! [steve sells] so the remake after forging, and normalizing (I never set a glowing blade down BTW) I placed it in the Vermiculite to cool, as Rich Hale advised me. [markb]You got your hands ful [JJ] Bruce i have a 4 yr of ger shep now the new pup...i think this one ought to make a fine tracker/hunter. time will tell....then we want to breed him with a sled dog. [steve sells] Bruce it was not a TINK,, it was actualy more like Ice cubes in a glass of water [brucegodlesky] ya mean it kinda crackled? [JJ] all hot forge work in my shop gets dropped ina lime bucket or air hung. one mistake ever once in a while is enough reminder of my stupidity [steve sells] ice breaking up crackle is close [markb] ear plugs won't help [steve sells] JJ I have 4 hangers for air cooling near the anvil so its not like I have a lot of effort to do it : [steve sells] But I wanted Chris to see why I was not using it anymore to show him WHY its not safe to try to salvage after a crack I explained, tho we can see that one squiggle line in the steel, and it does not go all the way though, what about other cracks we can not see? what ever caused this (stress) may have caused more... not worth the risk it was only 90F in shop then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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