Forging Carver Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 The rebar gives a nice texture. Nice opener! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Quint- Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 I keep trying to thank you guys for the kind words but the post keeps disappearing. And trying to say that my favorite part of this opener is the accidental twist. Thought I had the scroll (more like a Dr Seuss/Tim Burton curlicue) in line, but somehow messed that up, so I had to twist it into alignment with a final heat. I like the slightly spiraled rebar pattern Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panday Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 How long does it take you guys to make a basic opener? I seem to have maxed out at around 6 an hour if I do 3 at a time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 New Jersey was a major manufacturing area back when forges were part of many manufacturing processes; you need to check with junk and used machinery dealers---places with grim warehouses in bad parts of town. Think of how many post vises made their way into peoples basements when the factories closed down or retooled for more modern methods! Work old people in old houses and young people in old houses! Shoot even auto repair places used to have smithies---I bought a 6" post vise from one in inner city Columbus Ohio that had been in the same location since 1918. I didn't manage to get the anvil from the hospital; but I talked with the guy who used it as an orthopedic smith during WWII. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forging Carver Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Thanks for that Thomas powers! In nj, you don't wanna go in the bad parts of town!! Well at least where I am at! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 I've lived in NJ several times and graduated from Holmdel Highschool (Holmdel= mile 114-117 on the GSP) Will not darken the day with my stories of exploration... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 9 hours ago, Panday said: How long does it take you guys to make a basic opener? I seem to have maxed out at around 6 an hour if I do 3 at a time. Well, you're a lot faster than I am. Depends what material you're forging of course, but with rail spikes I would only get about two an hour. Put a ram's head on and it would take me an hour to do one. You're doing well to average one every ten minutes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panday Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 They're nothing fancy to be sure at 10mins/ea. I've been trying to make some to have more stuff under $20 on the table and still making a decent return. So the finished product is fairly rough, but at 6/hr I don't have any qualms selling them for $15. This is the first (and last) time I've made them from rebar. This particular stick had a unique pattern I wanted to do something with, otherwise I'm usually a bit more than indifferent to anything from rebar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forging Carver Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Wow two an hour! Do you guys swing your hammer as hard as you can? That might be my issue in that I do not swing the hammer with all my might. Also, do you guys use some sort of a drift to make the oval shape of the opener? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 You don't need to hit it as hard as you can, just efficiently. Smashing it super hard probably won't push the metal where you want it to go. Then you'll have all that extra work straitening out the mess you made and moving the metal back where it belongs. Hammer control is the key. If you have good hammer control, THEN you can hit harder and move more metal to pick up time. As far as the oval, Make it round 1st, then drive it from the other end against the step on the anvil or even the face. I know one of the Youtube videos that's been posted here shows clearly how to do this, but I don't have the link on this computer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Quint- Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 3 hours ago, Panday said: This is the first (and last) time I've made them from rebar. This particular stick had a unique pattern I wanted to do something with, otherwise I'm usually a bit more than indifferent to anything from rebar. Is rebar that much tougher to work than other steels? I've only really forged on rebar so far since I'm mostly practicing some basics, so I'm curious. Those look great by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panday Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Full power? No, not even close. Maybe only a third power while drifting. But swinging at 100% is dangerous IMO. I slit/drift with tools I made specifically for this purpose, and a 3lb hammer, but that only opens it up enough to finish opening and clean up the ring on the bick of the anvil. The rest I do with a 1.5# cross pien. 6 minutes ago, DSW said: As far as the oval, Make it round 1st, then drive it from the other end against the step on the anvil or even the face. I know one of the Youtube videos that's been posted here shows clearly how to do this, but I don't have the link on this computer. I also forge them round (or round-ish) over the bick, but I make the oval shape by hanging the ring over the far side and using careful hammering to "push" the ring into shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panday Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 7 minutes ago, -Quint- said: Is rebar that much tougher to work than other steels? I've only really forged on rebar so far since I'm mostly practicing some basics, so I'm curious. Those look great by the way. I couldn't say really, don't have enough experience with forging it to really say. This stuff forged pretty easy for me, but its also only 1/2" bar, and I'm one of those guys that can forge 1/2" to a point in one heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Quint- Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 1 hour ago, Panday said: I couldn't say really, don't have enough experience with forging it to really say. This stuff forged pretty easy for me, but its also only 1/2" bar, and I'm one of those guys that can forge 1/2" to a point in one heat. I found it fairly easy too, but I don't really have any thing to compare it to. Plus I'm pretty heavy handed in general... So is it just that it's basically junk steel that steers you away from it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forging Carver Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Alright thanks. I will look for a video on forging the opener dsw. If you do find it, let me know. Can you guys post some pictures of the drifts or punches you use made for forging openers? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panday Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 I just don't like the looks of the stuff. Actually, I'm not sure if its that, or that I see so much of it that II feel like its over used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 1 hour ago, Forging Carver said: Alright thanks. I will look for a video on forging the opener dsw. If you do find it, let me know. Can you guys post some pictures of the drifts or punches you use made for forging openers? Thanks This isn't the one I was looking for but it's not a bad video. I usually prefer to work with a longer piece of bar stock than he does and only cut it at the end so I don't have to use tongs the whole time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wC6JeBiVNs You can see several of my drifts in this thread. 1st one shown is a cheap punch I picked up at one of these cheesy import tool tents at the fair that sells stuff like HF. I needed something because I'd forgotten to grab the one I would have normally used. Tip is about 3/16" roughly. 2nd is just a tapered piece of 1/2" mild steel to open things up. Last is a small chunk of 1" that I tapered ( Originally it was a lathe project for putting a taper on a piece of stock) Steel is simply 1018 IIRC, so pretty much mild steel, but it would cut a bit nicer on the lathe. If I slit vs punch I've got a cheap cold chisel that I reground for hot work. If I get out in the shop this weekend, I'm half tempted to make an oval tapered drift from some 1" steel I have just to play a bit. I might try and push my hammer eye drift thru just to see how an oval shaped drift would work. http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/44532-improvised-anvil-horn/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forging Carver Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 Alright thanks that helps me so much! How much do you guys charge for a simple opener? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 I was getting $20 for simple ones at the Grange Fair. Of course the people were watching me forge them, so that probably added some value. Just about every one I'd forge when people were watching I'd sell to someone in the crowd. I tried to have one or two on the bench I'd done earlier as well in case someone didn't want to watch the whole thing, or in case there were two or three in the crowd who wanted one. RR spike ones or ones made from horse shoes, I could get up to $35 for. Depends on how intricate I made them and how much time I had into one. I could have probably sold more if I'd priced the simple ones at say $15. But then I'd have needed to have a ton of fives for change. Almost no one ever paid with fives and only occasionally paid with tens. 1 hour ago, Forging Carver said: Alright thanks. I will look for a video on forging the opener dsw. If you do find it, let me know. Can you guys post some pictures of the drifts or punches you use made for forging openers? Thanks Here's a pretty good one that also shows the drift he uses. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2jSW-HE-GE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forging Carver Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 So with the time put into them and the price you sell them at, do they make a good bit of cash for you? To me, it seems that openers would but I am not too sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 (edited) Regarding rebar-it is the varied composition that can make it rough to forge. It is essentially made from mixed types of scrap metal so you never really know what is in it, even from inch to inch in some cases. As to the value of openers, and making money with them. Everyone's situation will be a little different. Someone in the middle of Nevada may have a tough time selling one for $10, while they may be able to get $40 for the same one in Milwaukee where there is a bigger bar scene. There are some on here who get over $50 for an opener at certain events that draw a higher grade of clientele. When it comes to pricing you really need to do some research on the event that you are thinking of going to. How many other vendors will have similar items, how many vendors are there in total, how many attendees on average, will weather affect it , is it indoors or outdoors, what is the average income of the area around the event, how close to payday is it-rents are due on the first, will your items make nice gifts/holidays, are they easy to carry around the event, ..... And a few more I may have overlooked. All of these can mean either operating at a loss, or making a killing. I know someone who makes some Steampunk inspired items, and gets asked back to an event every year. They have done $6,000 in a weekend at this event. Why? They have unique items compared to the other vendors who sell a lot of like items between them. There is a thread on here that is called Pricing your items , if I remember correctly. The posts offer some good insight. Then there is the maxim of "under $20 and looks good in a double wide." That may be the best advice for craft fairs. For a brewfest where the attendees are devoted beer drinkers, you can charge a lot more of you have the quality to match the price. Demographics.... Edited December 5, 2015 by BIGGUNDOCTOR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beammeupscotty Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 50 minutes ago, BIGGUNDOCTOR said: Regarding rebar-it is the varied composition that can make it rough to forge. It is essentially made from mixed types of scrap metal so you never really know what is in it, even from inch to inch in some cases. As to the value of openers, and making money with them. Everyone's situation will be a little different. Someone in the middle of Nevada may have a tough time selling one for $10, while they may be able to get $40 for the same one in Milwaukee where there is a bigger bar scene. There are some on here who get over $50 for an opener at certain events that draw a higher grade of clientele. When it comes to pricing you really need to do some research on the event that you are thinking of going to. How many other vendors will have similar items, how many vendors are there in total, how many attendees on average, will weather affect it , is it indoors or outdoors, what is the average income of the area around the event, how close to payday is it-rents are due on the first, will your items make nice gifts/holidays, are they easy to carry around the event, ..... And a few more I may have overlooked. All of these can mean either operating at a loss, or making a killing. I know someone who makes some Steampunk inspired items, and gets asked back to an event every year. They have done $6,000 in a weekend at this event. Why? They have unique items compared to the other vendors who sell a lot of like items between them. There is a thread on here that is called Pricing your items , if I remember correctly. The posts offer some good insight. Then there is the maxim of "under $20 and looks good in a double wide." That may be the best advice for craft fairs. For a brewfest where the attendees are devoted beer drinkers, you can charge a lot more of you have the quality to match the price. Demographics.... Among others, I sold two today for $73.00 each. Assuming they are executed very well, I think one should charge what they are worth in terms of time, though even those $73.00 openers only netted me about thirty bucks an hour for my time after show expenses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 As we used to say in the furniture business: Sell to the classes, live with the masses; sell to the masses, live with the classes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panday Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 35 minutes ago, JHCC said: As we used to say in the furniture business: Sell to the classes, live with the masses; sell to the masses, live with the classes. That needs to be on the "Pearls" thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forging Carver Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 Ok thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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