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I Forge Iron

Ohio

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Everything posted by Ohio

  1. Sorry for no posts or photos. The basic grinder and flat table are built and painted. I have a couple more accessories to put together, but I was at a good place to stop and change up. I've moved the project back to my shop, the Wonder Hut, for the last parts. I also got the steel pegboard up on the last bench and need to replace the lighting before working on this or any other project. I had a set of scaffolding I was using as a fabrication table, but I think I'm going to change that out to a small fixture table with a top from Fireball Tool. Whew, my aching wallet. Regardless, I still have to weed out some tools and build rolling stands for others. I'm also going to build a Japanese-style forge on a rolling cart with a super sucker hood so I can move it to the door and send the smoke outside. I was going to have a permanent installation, and I still might at some point, but I have a small shop and move from project to project a lot. Anyway, I'll try to be in touch more.
  2. It is fun when something suddenly starts looking like what it's supposed to be for sure. Going over now to weld more of the assemblies. I organized all the parts, made cuts, and prepped for welding all the bits, so I think today will be all about fire. Then I'll grind as necessary. Normally I'd do one at a time, but they all use the same material for the arms and I know that material works as it's supposed to. Maybe this will speed things up. Maybe not. And maybe I'll change my mind once I get there. It is fun, though my neck and shoulders are feeling it.
  3. Well, at least my welds hold, as ugly as they are. It is exciting to make something and see it sort of looks the way it's supposed to. The platen assembly looks right and appears to work. I need to clean up the welds on the back of the platen—there are two bolt lengths on the back for attaching to the rest of the assembly. I don't need to do much, probably a bit of filing, and then use spacers to make sure the face of the platen is on the same plane as the assembly wheels. I mean, it really does look like what it is, so yay me. Next is the arm with the assembly for holding the tables. All the parts are cut and prepped but I have to bend some of the bits once I have most of it in place. I'll try to get more pictures but I keep forgetting.
  4. So I angle-ground some cuts and drilled some holes and then MIG welded the arm to the platen assembly. I took this before cleaning anything up. Next, I need to weld on these tiny little spacers. I'll probably glue them and do some tiny tacks. Got a bit cold in JT's shop. I always quit before I get tired—I learned this when skiing (which I don't do anymore because strapping my old butt to a couple of sticks and getting shoved downhill just isn't fun anymore): The minutes you say, "just one more run," it's time to stop before making a mistake or getting hurt. So I have a bunch of parts ready when I have this platen and assembly done.
  5. The sandblaster is in a cabinet in a shelter behind JTs shop. It works okay. I'm pretty much done with all that for now. The mineral oil is the stuff you get from the pharmacy or grocery store. I use it on cutting boards and it works very well. I've also wiped it on hot steel and it's beautiful and surprisingly tough. I've also polished it into steel work surfaces and it keeps the rust off pretty dang well, which is a big concern for me. The Wonder Hut is insulated (including the floor) and I have a fan blowing in there all the time (old one I used in a greenhouse) because dang, man, it's wet here, especially with El Nino making things el damp-o. Most of the coatings have gotten pretty good, so I'm feeling fairly confident the paint will work fine and my beeswax mix will work fine and all that. Now all I can see are each and every thing I messed up during the build. And designing a stand. And wondering if I could design and build some sort of fume/chip extractor so the dust is under control as the Wonder Hut is small. Next project (after sorting out the Wonder Hut) will probably be the bender trailer hitch stand. Or melting things. I miss melting things.
  6. Heh. Frosty, you kill me. So yesterday was more cutting and sandblasting of material. I have the Jer Schmidt with all the attachments and after some mistakes and miscounting, I had to get more material. How sad I had to go to one of my favorite store, Everett Steel. So, so sad. Tragic really. Because of the holidays, the drop bins were near empty, which is a bummer as there's often treasures in there. But I got what I needed so today I'll finish cutting and blasting and with a bit of, get back to welding the assemblies for the platen, fixed and moving tables, contact wheel, and something else I can't remember. After a brief discussion with JT, I think I'll be using a bit of heat and a beeswax/mineral oil wipe on some of the parts. I've used this a lot on forged and other items and it holds up well and resists rust. Since we're beekeepers (there's a story about that maybe I'll tell later) I have easy access to the wax and the mix I use is also food safe for use on wooden items like cutting boards, spoons, etc., which I also make. It's an easy finish and pleasant to work with. I'll still paint parts of my as-yet-unnamed grinder, but for parts that have to move, this finish should serve me well. Sandblasting is cool. At first. It's wonderful to see a surface get all nice and clean but then I start feeling it in my hands, arms, shoulders, neck, etc. It can be sort of hypnotic, which is nice. I do not like cutting with the abrasive saw. It's smelly and loud. I really like using bandsaws but JT's bandsaw is not great. I have an adorable little Craftsman that I rebuilt and cuts very well and a Jet that someone gave me (that needs to be rebuilt and tuned), but they are sitting, lonely and forlorn, in the Wonder Hut. So abrasive saw it is. I wear full PPE for all this stuff but it's just less pleasant than using other tools. Boo hoo, boo hoo. And when I start feeling tired, I'm done. I do this for fun and getting hurt is what I call no fun. At some point I'll be back to welding and I keep forgetting to take pictures.
  7. Yesterday was organizing and sandblasting. I have to build the platen assembly and thought I'd do some easier stuff first. So I gathered the pieces for the fixed and adjustable tables and sandblasted the parts. I should have spent the first two days of the project sandblasting everything before assembly and weld, but too bad, so sad, I didn't. I still have to separate pieces into the other assemblies, such as the large wheel and small wheel forks and sandblast them but it is DUMPING rain, as in, maybe I should start gathering animals and making sure the ark has a room for poo<-this is a joke, no need to tell me that the poo would just get flung overboard. So I am staying home and drinking hot chocolate in my jammies today. I also have to get some 1.5"x1.5"x,25" wall mild steel as I used this material in the wrong places and need more. That's swell. And it's going to be a bummer because I can either go to the scrap yard, where I end up buying material I don't need because of the price, or I go to Everett Steel and go through the drop bin like a crazed racoon looking for rusty treasure. My fab GF wants to go along this time, so that will be fun. I'm usually not profligate with money but I can feel my Visa card slipping out of my wallet as soon as I step foot in these places. Well, at least I have a current tetanus shot and some steel-toed workboots. I'll probably refrain from fabrication until next week and let my buddy enjoy his holidays. The fab GF baked him a stollen yesterday and he seemed pretty happy about that—it was still warm when she brought it over.
  8. So yesterday, I forged an eyebolt-ish thing instead of cutting an existing one to sue on the grinder. I've got the tension arm on and the axle for the upper wheel. The entire thing looks funny, especially the legs, and I don't like the stand. I'm sure it will work fine but I'll probably change that once I know exactly what I want. I have to build the platen with the smallest wheels and the table, then I have an adjustable table and a big wheel attachment accessories to build. Then clean (should have sandblasted prior), prime and paint in Wonder Hut forest green. Yes, my built or restored tools are forest green. I belong to an online metalheads group and that's where I bought in for lasercut parts for this build. JT was going to make all the parts but one of the metalheads was selling his kit for a get-it-out-of-here price. So I got JT his pre-cut parts for his build for like, a hundred bucks. And the metalhead I got it from let me see his shop. Dude was a fabricator and let me tell you, his "hobby" shop is awesome—and the welds on his build of this grinder (his painted John Deere green) are, like, beautiful. The metalheads are mostly fabricators/welders/machinists with tons of experience and they're pretty cool. Anyway, JT got a five-gallon bucket and parts and I'm pretty sure he cried a little. I don't think he gets many presents. And he cleared out his shop so his forge will be free of crap and ready to work after the first of the year. I'm pretty excited. I have my charcoal-based forge but the Wonder Hut is a disaster and I get overwhelmed when I look in there (yes, I will get it sorted, and soon). JT has a multi-burner propane-based table where he uses firebrick to build the forge shapes he needs for certain projects. I'll be back to re-learning hammer technique. Yesterday, though, forging the eyebolt was really fun. We used a torch to heat up the steel and I got it done in all of five minutes. And we lathed another part to fit a piece of pipe—making stuff is fun.
  9. So I said I'd get some pictures but I am a liar. It's wet and cold and I started freezing up pretty quickly. Yeah, okay, it's not Alaska cold, and I am a delicate flower. I finished welding together the main body and the tensioner arm. Got out a flap wheel to clean up my usual mess. The new welding helmet is great but the welder was being cranky. JT says he's got a new regulator coming and that should solve the issue. Way more spatter than before and definitely connected to not enough shielding gas coming through. Annoying more than anything. Clamp small bits to other small bits is actually kind of fun. Until I screw it up and parts roll under a bench or big pile of scrap. I actually enjoy it, though. Next step is assembly of the main body of the grinder. I have some other parts to weld, but I think the idea is to make sure the main body goes together and rotates properly. Then comes building the sliding table, fork for the big wheel and all that. JT has been inside taking care of his spouse, so it's not as fun. I do get more done, but when he's around, I end up laughing a lot more. I miss being in the Wonder Hut (when it's organized), which reminds me---I need to get some of those HF LED shop lights for in there. Quote of the day: "When you can see, you can actually weld." JT because my welds look a lot better because of my new welding helmet.
  10. I'm going to follow your poetry, Frosty, with a naming story of my own. We named the Toto toilets in the new house (which I built and still haven't finished---don't ask) after my parents. They insisted on giving us money so I told them I'd pay for the plumbing fixtures and name the toilets after them. My mom was all, "Just be sure to get good ones." I have to put the nameplates up still.
  11. Well, yeah. If you hear a string of swear words coming from the south, that's me. Sorry if they hurt your delicate sensibilities. I know how fragile your sense of propriety is. I like the story about your mom—that's really sweet and what a great way to honor somebody. And the rename jinx is totally real and that's my story and I'm sticking to it. Yes! Like a flashlight. Perfect description. The BD welder runs like that and it's so surprising because this welder was inexpensive. It makes doing the welds really enjoyable, though I like it even when the welder runs like a crapmobile. I always find it amazing that I, me, a semi-normal person, can melt metal with lightning and make other metal stick together and it actually works. Same thing with forging, me, a normal person, hits hot metal with a hammer and it moves. I find this delightful and amazing. Once I'm over my delight, I need grinders. All sorts of grinders. "Grinder and paint makes me the welder I ain't," as they say. My grinder-to-welder use ratio is about 10:1, which is better because it used to be 25:1. This build is about realizing that better technique using well-designed and appropriate tools will give me a better result. Getting better is another source of amazement and delight.
  12. Of course it's coarse. And that's just fine. Or finer. Or maybe finest. Or maybe just enough to take the edge off. I'll stop now and file this away. I may have to put up a poll to let everybody vote on names. I like most of them. So I think I've recovered enough from this little bit of surgery to go back in the shop tomorrow and/or Friday. Bzzzt bzzt bzzt <- that's the sound of me MIG welding the rest of the bits. JT has this little lunchbox-y Blue Demon MIG welder that works...great. I'm not a professional, though I can spell "welding," so that makes me qualified. Srsly, I have one of those little Lincoln 140 MIG/fluxcore welders and I'm thinking maybe I'd get one of these Blue Demons. That last bit is a lie. If I get another welder, it will be something different as Weldy (not its real name) is just fine for my needs. Need a better cart and I need to get the shielding gas set up, but I've done a lot with the Lincoln and fluxcore. I would like to 1) not suck at welding 2) have different capabilities for different projects, like TIG for aluminum, and 3) use fire in new and exciting (but not painful other than to the wallet) ways. I've kinda fell into that got-more-projects-that-need-bigger-tools pit. I don't think I'll ever do automobiles----not my thing, but the neighbor on the other side is really into that. He built a rock-climbing truck and it was great to see him put it together. Dude's gifted and that's not sarcasm. He's a certified welder and has a ton of skills. It's fun to watch him, other than that he plays very heavy metal and very loud volume. He's a good guy. We're lucky---most of our neighbors are great and feel perfectly comfortable coming over to "help" by giving me "advice" aka pointing and laughing. Anyway, I'll see if I can get some pictures. And does anyone know if I can do a poll? That'd be hilarious, esp. if one of youse says. "let's call it Grindy McGrinderface" and that's the one that wins.
  13. That's an excellent point, Buzzkill. An improper name could wreck this entire build. The way I fabricate, there's a good chance it is the clever name that keeps things holding together. Grindy feels little too-on-the-nose, esp. since the hot tub is called Tubby. Sandy, after Sandy Koufax, is a bit too cute, though I do enjoy baseball. Remove-y sounds too insane. My Personality is too long, though I am a bit abrasive (get it?). Big Pile of Money is accurate but lacks a certain je ne sais quo. Humph. I'm going to have to think about this.
  14. So I've had all the bits for my grinder sitting in the Wonder Hut for over a year. Last summer, my mentor and pal, JT, suggested we start fabricating. I had gotten a pre-cut kit from Seattle MetalHeads sitting in a stack and it was time. MetalHeads is an email group I've belonged to since dinosaurs roamed the earth and a bunch of us went in on getting the pieces CNC cut since Jer provides the CNC files in his plans. JT does not have the pre-cut kit so we'll be doing everything one step at a time. (If you want to build Jer's design, buy the plans from him. They're cheap and the design appears to be terrific. Jer will also answer questions about the build, and has videos for his Gen 1 and Gen 2 designs on YT. Most of his instructions (and his method of build) are aimed for less-experienced metalworkers so if you have a lot of experience, you'll see some places where you can do things a bit more quickly/easily. He's not making money from this; he's an engineer who likes to build tools and how can you not like that?) What I've learned so far: my welds suck. They'll hold but, wow, I have lost a lot of ability. My new welding helmet with that new welding-helmet smell has made a huge amount of difference. I have also learned that I could have bought a cheap grinder for less than I'm spending and I don't care. I'm having fun, remembering how to do stuff, and looking forward to putting this baby to work. I also want to design and fabricate a moveable stand for the grinder that will work well in the Wonder Hut. The Hut isn't very big, but I have a roll-up door, so I can move the grinder close to it and use a fan to send the grinding dust out. I was also thinking I may come up with a curtain system that I can pull around the grinder to stop the crap from getting into the rest of the shop. But that is for another day. I am recovering from a bit or oral surgery (ow ow ow) and won't be doing much in the shop for a few days yet because I am a big baby. But what's next is welding on one more assembly to the body of the grinder and putting the entire thing together to make sure it's going to work. Then I'll fabricate the accessories (small wheel, adjustable angle table, large wheel) and do a last clean up to the welds, etc., sandblast, prime and paint. All the parts will then go back into the Wonder Hut to sit until I've fabricated the moveable table. In all honesty, I work slow. I'm constantly re-checking what I'm doing and I'm in someone else's shop, but the biggest reason is me and JT spend a lot of time jabbering. It's really fun and it's good for each of us: he gets out of the house to tell me what to do, and I get away from the manuscript to use a different part of my brain. I'll try to get pictures from now on—pictures from far away because as I said, my welds suck. Embarrassingly bad.
  15. And JHCC comes across with a potential moneymaking opportunity. Srsly, we have dozens and dozens of skellertons, of all sizes, most of which were purchased from a defunct chiropractor school by the defunct haunted house. Maybe I could finance that new welder.
  16. Irondragon, you are very kind. And back at you. Hope you and Debi are doing well, healthy and happy and all. The retort isn't hard to build and I will say when it's working and the chimney sounds like a jet engine, it's pretty neat. And you can see the offgases burning in the pyrolysis process, which I like because it starts with pyro. I like making stuff. I made a bunch of fancy cutting boards and stuff—we have a small business to sell honey, beeswax, soap, candles, all that crap, and we added the wood products. I like making stuff —it's fun and my risk of arrest is much lower. Das, we go into the big city for Halloween at my friend's house. Her entire basement is full of Halloween props, including many, many, many skeletons— or "skellertons" as I like to say. Years ago one of those local haunted house operations was going out of business and we essentially bought all their crap. Took two trips in her F250 to get everything back to her house. Buying all of it seemed perfectly reasonable at the time. We have since weeded out a lot of stuff, but there are plastic crates jammed with terror that remain. Every year I swear I'm going to get it all organized and, like the Wonder Hut, I fail in such a massive way, my failure has it's own gravity. And reading what happened to those typewriters, that's a tragedy on par with human trafficking <- this is a joke. But dang, that bums me out.
  17. We use a hotbox I got from a restaurant that was going out of business. Four-gallon rectangular bucket with appx. half a gallon of water in the bottom, with three layers of cheesecloth that's wet clamped or bungee corded to the top. All the wax, cappings, crazy comb, or off the frames, goes onto the cheesecloth. I usually separate capping from other wax but not always. Last batch was twelve five-gallon bucks (at least 20# each) crammed full of scrapped frame wax that was super gross. Two buckets fit easily into the hot box—is the half-size kind—keeping airflow. The buckets rest on an aluminum tray to keep the hotbox somewhat tidy. Three hours at max temp 170F, the wax is rendered clean but still melted. Next morning, the wax is hardened and they pop right out of the rectangular buckets. Get anywhere from 1-2 pounds per bucket in each batch. We've even dropped the rendered wax into a 1-pound and 1-ounce beeswax molds and the wax melts to the correct size and weight that we sell in our booth.
  18. Frosty, I have notebooks from when I'm away from a computer, like at night when I can't sleep or early in the morning when I can't sleep, or when I'm outside or in the shop, and I can't sleep. Oh, wait, no—I don't sleep in the shop, that would be dangerous. But I have little notebooks in there and they get full of all kinds of things. My belt grinder is in my pal's shop/garage. He wanted to build them together, mostly to watch me make every possible mistake before he started his. Working out for him, let me tell you. Right now he's unavailable (and I don't like working in his shop without him there) for the next week or so. We have a lot of fun, though these one-week projects turn into multi-month things. Ah, I don't care. He's a good guy and it's a blast to do stuff over there. BTW I use a typewriter, too, esp. with an early draft. I have a bad habit of going back to revise when I need to just keep going forward. I wrote my first two books on a 1930's LC Smith & Corona that died a while back. Now I have a 1970s Smith-Corona portable, but what I really want is a Blickensderfer? Why, you ask? So I can say "Blickensderfer," duh. Das, don't let my sterling prose fool you. I do several dumb things every single day. I have a knack for it. I'll try to remember to take some pictures of this build. After the belt grinder is a mount for my Di-Acro bender. I saw this one guy mounted his on a trailer hitch, so he could use his truck for a counterweight and I thought, "That's the deal for me." The Wonder Hut is still a nightmare-ish armpit of a mess. I made a Dracula coffin out of foam for Halloween and stuck it in there and it's just in the way. I mean, it looks really good for a foam-based Halloween prop, but it's big and I have to get it up on the upper shelves and it's been cold and I'm delicate.
  19. Frosty sent a message this morning to let me know about Thomas Powers and Glenn. I am sad. I planned to have a fire this week as it's cold but dry, and I'll raise a glass to each. The toast, "To absent friends," or "Fire is pretty." Maybe both. The fire I planned is to burn some scribbled pages for the new book*, which ash kept me underwater for the past year or so. There is no blacksmith in this one, though there is in the next (or the one after that) and I was hoping to get help for research, etc. from this community, esp. TP as he was a neverending fount of information. But sometimes the fount does end and to paraphrase Glenn, there are many here I think of frequently (look at you, Frosty) and only swear a little (again, looking at you Frosty), and while I won't say I love you as I require dinner and dancing before admitting to that, I will say I have respect and fondness of the generosity, humor, and welcome I have found here. And in the effort to be a better visitor to the joint, I may start telling the story of How I Built My Belt Grinder, still in progress and complete with crappy welds and a huge mistake I made last week that I still have to correct (angle grind) and re-do. *I burn note pages from the manuscript I'm working on as fuel for my imagination. I don't burn books, but my notes are of no use to anyone and I am just superstitious enough to believe fire will release the words so they can re-arrange themselves and come back when I'm ready. Now that I just re-read what I wrote, it sounds kinda dumb. Oh, well. Kinda dumb is wort of my thing. While Frosty's tenet is, "dum vivimus vivamus" (while you live, live), mine is more like, "dumb vivimus vivamus," (while you live, do something dumb).
  20. For this design, assume it will take a minimum of 3 hours once the pyrolization starts. I will go to 4 hours after pyrolization just to be sure, but usually, I have to feed fuel to the rocket stove for the last 45 minutes or so. Then I close up the lower opening with mineral wool and let it sit overnight before opening the barrel. The material is often a mix of hard and softwood, and usually dry. Assume wet (fresh) wood, like tree limbs, etc., will take longer for the moisture to cook off. I haven't done that, so I don't know how long that would take to complete the process. I think you'll have to try different times for different materials to get what you want.
  21. I built a retort based on the Hookway design and wrote it up here. There are other links in this thread that may help you. I haven't used the other method. My retort (named Burnie) also uses the gases from pyrolysis---as does Hookway's---to continue the charcoal process. Basically, I start a fire in the rocket stove (named Rocket J. Stove) with small lengths of wood. After about an hour, the pyrolysis gases start feeding this fire and I don't have to add fuel for about an hour and a half. I then add small pieces of wood to finish the charcoal process. If you look at the pictures in the linked thread above, you should be able to see how the gases are fed into the rocket stove. Rocket stoves burn very hot with little smoke and you can use small pieces of dried materials. I also added a 3-foot length of stove pipe to the top where the rocket stove exits to ensure draw and it works great, though it roars fairly loudly. It's a very clean burn with very little smoke. But there will be smells. Anything on the steel parts (paint, oil, grease, etc.) will burn off and stink. Sealing materials often smell as they heat up. The area around the barrel may get singed and smell, though you can always put the barrel in sand. Just keep cats away or you may heat up sand that gives off a completely different smell you weren't expecting. When you open the main drum to empty the charcoal, which you do the next day otherwise it can explode, I find the smell from inside overpowering, like being stuffed into a chimney that hasn't been cleaned since Charles Dickens was alive. I wear a respirator that also protects from the dust because charcoal is VERY dusty. I wear dispoable gloves and clothes I throw away because you will not get the dust out of your clothes. This is a messy and not fun process. Varying the size of the feedstock (the stuff that goes into the main drum) and how long you let it burn affects the end result. I don't use this charcoal for cooking or smoking food, so I'm looking for full cooked charcoal for smithing. You can get less than fully-pyrolized charcoal by using bigger chunks of material or less burn time. For example, I did a cycle with larger hardwood pieces for 3 hours. All of the material is usable, but some is not fully pyrolized. I now do everything for 4 hours before stuffing the rocket stove opening with mineral wool insulation to put out the fire. You can buy Hookway's design drawings off his website and it may help you visualize how the design works. The key is insulation. I've also found that some smoke is unavoidable. You can lessen it somewhat, but there's always going to be some. I use a clay mix to seal openings because it's cheap and works surprisingly well, and that gives off steam until everything is fully dry. I think there are also variations of this design that use smaller (5-gallon) drums and amount of feedstock that may work better for you---less smoke, less dust, etc. Hope this helps.
  22. Welding tips and tricks Jody isn't just a great welder, he's a great teacher. He goes through troubleshooting techniques as well as every other possible welding topic you can think of. Hope it helps.
  23. Heh. I'm good making charcoal for my own use. I got a chainsaw, machete, and Burnie the retort. I still have to do a couple batches before summer is here---don't want to burn anything outside when it's dry. Re: Chunkers, Inc. My neighbor/pal wants to build one because he loves crap like that. He has a rock crusher already (which is pretty fun, I will admit) and this is his thing. He, of course, is the same neighbor who set himself on fire a couple years ago---dude's over 70, you'd think he'd have some sense, but nooooo. Anyway, it'd be fun, but I had to impose a rule about only buying and building stuff I'll actually use. I know---insane, not normal, and clearly a sign I'm a communist or something.
  24. Frosty, my dude, there is so much feedstock it would make even you weep. And I have my tree guy who chops and chips and a firewood operation just over yonder (end of the gravel road, take a right and there they are). It's the building of a chunker to chop the stuff that people don't want as firewood into the right size that gives me pause. Could I build one? Yes. Could I buy one? Yes. The chunked material would go through a series of screens to get the crap out, and into the retort/charcoal cooker. Cook it all up, back through the screens to sort, and bagged. All doable. But who do I sell it to? I'm not kidding when I say every blacksmith I know uses propane out here. Those of us that don't are few and far between, so I don't see breaking even trying to serve this market. But I might be able to make the other products to even it out. I've even thought that given the wildfires we had last summer---air quality was horrid---I could even pitch the idea of making charcoal as carbon capture and wildfire mitigation or prevention, which is a good message out here in hippie land. But the smell of the retort when you open it up. I don't barf easy but that smell seriously makes me want to and watching people barf is only funny if it isn't you. arkie, in one of my lines of work, we call that Hoss situation an opportunity. He's making the market and having to pave the way tog et people to consider cooking with mesquite. You follow behind. Your overhead regarding marketing would be considerably lower as you surf his brand and sell at a lower price, making your margins healthier. You're not competing with Hoss, you're competing with Kingsford. Hoss is just going to break ground for you.
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