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I Forge Iron

EWCTool

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  1. It really does look kind of small. I think the angle and the camera lens took off some pounds. Here is a picture of me next to the hammer. For reference I'm 6' 3". I'm with you on the electric motor, that and several other factors are being worked out. Ill keep things posted. E.
  2. Today The Williams White power hammer arrived! It is a 90 pound hammer. I have an electric motor for it, but am still debating about whether to get three phase to the shop or just get a Honda or Briggs and Stratton engine to run it. The other plan under construction is the foundation. Just thought I would share. E.
  3. I am curious as to what the majority of smiths today are using. When taking the poll, please only vote for the type of hammer that gets the most attention/use in your shop. This poll only applies to power hammers; not presses, treadle hammers, hand hammers, etc. Thank you
  4. I have always been under the influence that forging is superior to casting. Being a blacksmith I am bias to forging anyways. But with metallurgy as advanced as it is today could one argue, given particular circumstances, that casting is as good as forging? I mean just look at anvils. I know of one maybe two anvil manufacturer that forges them. A majority of the others are all cast. I would like to have a forged anvil one day (just to say I have one), but my current anvil is cast steel and it holds up fine. The argument leads into grain refinement, but it is possible to get finer grain size through different methods of heat treatment depending on the material you are working with. I have often wondered if this debate is residual "old world" knowledge from a time when forging was the superior manufacturing method. I may be wrong but are'nt the Hofi hammers cast? http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/23397-bp1000b-the-real-story-about-the-hofi-hammer/ Scroll to the bottom of the page for information on this topic. But then we are presented with information such as this http://www.peddinghausanvils.com/forging_benefits.htm How much of either of these claims are backed up with scientific studies I do not know. They may be true, or they could be a marketing scheme. The conclusion I have come to is that the difference in quality is so minute anymore that I really do not notice. Instead of questioning the actual manufacturing process I question other aspects such as tool geometry and material. I have seen blades that are cast, and I for one was appalled. The reviews for the knives said they were not half bad. I reckon it just goes to show that the qualities of today's materials are much higher than they used to be.
  5. Look at colonial ironwork. This is a great example of ironwork that was completed for the most part without the aid of a power hammer, although the striker was employed a lot back then. What I notice when I look at colonial ironwork is that it is very thin in construction. They did not want it to be heavy and it was cheaper to make it that way. another good example of fine and delicate work, perhaps the best example would be Samuel Yellin's work. He is arguably the best iron worker that I know of and I will hold fast to that statement. http://www.amazon.com/Colonial-Wrought-Iron-Sorber-Collection/dp/1879535165/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1365180616&sr=8-1&keywords=colonial+wrought+iron http://www.samuelyellin.com/ As stated above, a power hammer or a striker will increase your efficiency, but as long as you are doing this as a hobby you can throw efficiency out the window. It is hard if not impossible to run a business without some sort of assistance whether it is mechanical or human. The occupation that moves metal by hand without the aid of external help is considered a jeweler. That being said, do realize that you never really do leave the realm of simple trinkets. There is a book I think you would find interesting. http://www.amazon.com/Fireplace-Accessories-Dona-Z-Meilach/dp/076431615X/ref=sr_1_6?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1365180173&sr=1-6&keywords=fireplace+tools In this book they explain how perspective buyers may wish to observe a completed fireplace set as a sort of resume of skills. I love this part of the book. It discusses how just about every blacksmithing operation is used to create a fireplace set along with the smith's creativity is also reflected in the work. Just remember what ever you make, no matter how simple can always be done more elaborately. Many smiths, myself included, seem to think that improvement of skills means an increase in scale. This may not always be true. Take a look back on the things you have created before and think how can they be improved either in function or in artistic quality. Just a side note, another tool to consider is a treadle hammer. It is not as involved as a power hammer, but it will help nonetheless. I run a hobby/business shop. I do not own a power hammer or a treadle hammer.
  6. Has anyone ever received written permission to enter the property of a railroad and take unused steel?
  7. I have used rail anvils and I do not think highly of them. I see it more as a source of hot rolled 1085. The head could be cut off and made into hammers and anvils tools. The web and base could be split into stock for any tool really. I would wager that some very nice stake anvils could be forged from the rail. I also think it would be fun to make miniature anvils to sell as door stops. Do not forget the mountain of railroad spikes that would also accompany the rail. It would be a lot of work and it is probably not the most efficient way to get steel, but I am a blacksmith and am resourceful. I'll find a way to make it work. I know it is a large undertaking but I like these sorts of jobs. The kind that are so hard no one in their right mind would undertake. Nothing ventured nothing gain right. But as everyone has already said it has to be legal first before any thing can be done. This is always the first priority.
  8. The local real estate assessor did not help. They did not even have a railroad on the map, it was just some weird easement. However the active lines were present on the map. I am still going to find the legitimate owner of the rail before I try anything as I know how hard the railroad companies can come down on people who mess with their property. Has anyone ever had any luck approaching them and getting permission to even collect spikes scattered about? Is there any incentive for them to keep the line, even in the present condition? I heard one story of them wanting to keep another line because they were selling the land and they wanted to claim it had rail access. The line was just as old or older and in no better shape. As questionable as that sounds it is still their property and they can do with it as they choose.
  9. I know of an abandon railroad near me. The date on the tie plates says 1925 and it looks like they have not been touched in at least 50 years. The brush has overgrown and in most places the trees growing up through the rails are doing a better job holding the rail to the ground than the rotted out ties. The rail is ripe for the picking. It is one thing to go and swipe spikes that are lying around but another thing to pull up the rails without asking. I am a chemistry major not an engineer but I think anyone could tell that trains will never again run on this line. I am more worried about the legal ramifications of taking the rails more than anything. I have a possible owner of the tracks, it is a shortline company not some bigwig name like CSX or Norfolk Southern. I have yet to contact them but do any of you think I have a chance of them giving me permission to take some rail? I feel my chances are better since they are a shortline company. Also does anyone know if there is incentive for them to keep the tracks at this point? I would assume that they would be a liability risk and they would want them gone, but I have not researched the topic.
  10. My general rule is: The metal will move where 1. Force is directed into the metal, and 2. Where the metal is in a condition (malleable/hot) in which the force directed onto the metal will cause it to move. This means the plane in which the metal is struck the above statement is true. The location on the metal where the strike occurred will deform and the portion not struck will not be deformed. However, on the opposite side (the anvil face) there is more surface area in contact with the anvil. When an object is struck the entire object tends to go in motion (Newton's Laws). That motion will be stopped by the anvil, causing the deformation to be at a maximum directly under the hammer blow, but also present nonetheless in close to the impact. Take for example a long piece of steel that has a radius placed on the deck of the aircraft carrier with the radius face down. The steel is then struck with a hammer. The result would not be present under the hammer but a general reduction of the radius due to the large surface contact with the aircraft carrier. This is generally the case if the entire piece of steel is under the same conditions (composition, temperature, etc.). But the area directly under the hammer face could be the only area impacted by the strike if that was the only portion of the steel that was heated. Generally this is not the case. All this being said it does not discredit the viability of the rail anvil. It does a very good job at directing force into the steel in a very controlled fashion.
  11. You could forge one end down to fit into the hardy hole. Cut the thing in half so that the eye forms a semicircle and either grind or forge the eye into a swage. I have done something similar to this and it makes a dandy swage. This way you get 2 swages from one head.
  12. The moving of metal via hammering is a science. Freeman Dyson wrote a work titled "The Scientist as Rebel," in which he stated that many scientists were engaged in "a rebellion against the restrictions imposed by the locally prevailing culture." The context in which this was written was the debate between science and religion, but I felt it can be applied to this topic. Science advances through questioning, experimentation, and criticism. The theories that stand up to this criticism are the theories that are remembered and passed on. The questioning is not because some of us do not simply "get it," but because we want to further our understanding of not only the tool under question but also the method and logic under which the tool is to be used. The questioning is necessary for the advancement of the craft. With that said, can something be clarified for me? If the best and most versatile of all the blacksmith's hammers is the rounding hammer, why is it not marketed at the local hardware store? If I go into Lowes or Home Depot right now and ask someone there for a blacksmith’s hammer they will point me to the standard cross peen. Even on the tag it is listed as a Blacksmith’s hammer. (Just to share, I was looking at some pipe in Lowes one day and I overheard a conversation between the helper and the customer. The customer wanted pipe he could weld to make some stand. The helper stated that the galvanized pipe would be the best because you do not have to weld through all that black paint. This story shows that I realize most people do not know as much about metal working as the average blacksmith, but they still connect the blacksmith with the cross peen.) My point being that after a couple millennia of metal working, and the cross peen is still the public’s perception of the “blacksmith hammer.” Is it because the general population is not in a real need for tools that are specifically designed to move metal and the sale of the cross peen is a way that they are able to sell more hammers? Or is it the most versatile of the hammers? Thoughts?
  13. I saw on another website that the 700 is up and running. That hammer is very impressive when it comes to control. Float like butterfly, smash with thunder. I bet moving that much metal so effortlessly never gets old.
  14. I hate to ask but have you considered propane. I would never go with propane, I like playing/managing the fire. I have not done the math but I am fairly confident in saying that I am getting a better deal burning coal over propane. I do not have enough experience with propane to tell you how much propane = one pound of charcoal/coke. If you read up on it you could probably find out. I have heard nothing but good things about propane by those who use it. The one downside is that you can not concentrate the heat with propane like you can with coal. But for the most part the guys who use propane typically have a rose bud torch for specific heating. I reckon I am to much of a purist to switch, but the I heard one comparison that I thought was interesting. Propane vs coal is equivalent to campfire to oven. Propane is available everywhere, but If you are happy with your charcoal then why fix what is not broken. As long as it heats the metal at an affordable rate then you are doing fine.
  15. I am very surprised at how high the cost of coal is up there. $1/lb is very expensive. I get my coal for $0.18/lb down here in Virginia. I get it by the pallet, but even if you don't buy in bulk it is still only $0.19/lb. When I started buying coal it was around $0.11/lb. If I were you I would contact heating oil and gas companies, they usually carry coal. I don't believe I have ever seen a hardware store that carried coal. I know a smith in New York who used to buy coal in 20 ton truck loads. Due to his locality the only coal he could get was the hard stuff. I mean if they left it under the ground for another day or two they would have been mining diamonds. He wanted the good stuff and the only way he could get it was by ordering large amounts of it. He also did not get coal, it was industrial coke bound for steel mills and blast furnaces. This stuff is what every blacksmith dreams of forging with. It burns as clean as your charcoal without the ash, but burns for much longer. If you have the means you could look into this and sell some with a mark up if you are ambitious enough. Another method I have heard is to hang off a bridge with a broom as a train goes by and brush the coal off the tops of the cars. The problem is that more often than not the trains are loaded with anthracite headed to some power plant. I would advise against this method. I don't know how much you have read in to it, but there is a difference between coal and charcoal. When you burn coal, you are actually heating the metal with coke. coke is more or less "pure" carbon after all the volatile stuff has been burned/boiled off. Coke chemically is nearly identical to charcoal only denser, The advantage to using coal is that because it is denser that charcoal it will burn longer. I have used charcoal before and it is an amazingly clean burning fire, but it burns so quickly and the ash gets everywhere I usually don't bother. I kind of covered the basics, there is much more information out there on this topic.
  16. Are there any methods that can be used to dampen the noise from a power hammer
  17. That makes sense, especially about the squished ball compared to the semi sphere. Just to make sure I am hearing you right. If you want to spread (move metal in all directions) you would use a hammer that creates an impression that is narrower than the width of the material being worked (or tilt the rounding hammer handle to be more parallel to the ground). If you want to draw out stock from one dimension to a smaller dimension you would use a hammer that creates an impression that is wider than the width of the material being worked (or move the handle of the rounding hammer away for parallel and closer to perpendicular.) Consider this type of hammer and tell if my logic is off. A hammer with a cross/straight/diagonal peen but the corners where forged/dressed so that when the peen is laid on the anvil face and the handle was parallel to the ground the curvature of the peen would look like a smiling mouth. This kind of hammer would have the characteristics of a cross/straight/diagonal peen combined with a ball peen depending on the angle of impact. Now what about a hammer that would be a cross between a rounding and standard face. I would consider such a hammer to have an exaggerated crown. It would have the ability to change the angle of the handle relative to the ground to change the surface area that was impacting the material, while still being able to act as a standard hammer face. In my mind I have more control of the metal with a flat face. It goes exactly where I want it to go (I am thinking of drawing in this example, it would be different if I was thinking of spreading). From my thinking, a hammer that has a cross/straight/diagonal peen dressed as stated above combined with an exaggerated crown (also described above) forged within a weight range and handle length that was suitable for the user would be the best all around general forging hammer. This would combine the cross/straight/diagonal peen with the ball peen on one side along with a rounding hammer and standard hammer on the other. Any logic to this or have I fallen into another philosophical hole.
  18. Don't get on Dan's case, it is frustrating when it seems that every so often someone brings a new technique out. In a way it is almost like your means of conducting this craft are being questioned, like you have been doing it all wrong from the get go. He has his way of doing things and has a right to question the new techniques that arise. This questioning is how the good ones remain and the bad ones fade. I also don't want this thread to close, I am curious about my questions above.
  19. I agree that a smaller surface area would have more pounds per inch, but if too much pressure was applied I could see it distorting the side being struck. Whereas if a flat, but properly crowned, face were employed less pressure would need to be applied resulting in less distortion. Where is the cutoff be for size of the surface area. I feel that at some point you would be swinging a punch instead of a hammer. In fact a punch would provide the most pounds per square inch in that the surface area contacting the metal would be minimal. I don't mean to provoke I am only curious. How did you come up with the radius for the hammer? I heard you say that it was more of a squished semi sphere than a semi sphere. I have many different hammers with many different peins suited to the specific needs that may arise. Do you have one rounding hammer or multiple of different weights and different radii, or a combination of different radii with the same weight hammer, or a combination of different weights within the same radii? It seems I have fallen into a philosophical hole. We found the best type of forging hammer out of all the hammers available. Now what is the best type of rounding hammer for forging? In your video of forging tongs you use the rounding hammer to draw the reigns out. Why not use a straight or cross pein combined with the edge of the anvil? You speak of surface area, which your argument is true, but not in the drawing case. The rounding hammer would be best for spreading, but I try to avoid spreading when I am drawing. When I am drawing I want the metal to move in one direction, so I use a cross/straight pein depending on which direction I want the metal to go. Now how does all this tie into the "hit turn" method described by Toby Hickman. In his video he claims that to be the most controlled systematic way to forge a bar down to size. He also says that this is employed to power hammer users and hand forgers alike. I agree that the surface area of the face that is contacting the metal is important. But I also think that control of the direction of metal flow is also important. I am glad to see the techniques being broadcasted without the advertisement at the end. I also like the lack of large machinery like power hammers and presses. It is very applicable to the average hobby blacksmith.
  20. I would say a power hammer beats all. You can work small stock, and large stock. They are very agreeable, never get tired, and are always on time.
  21. I have always figured I will make an item as perfect or "traditional" as the customer is willing to pay me. It is good to see that many smiths are continuing the traditional techniques, but that is just as important as embracing the new technologies. In order for the craft to not just survive but thrive both techniques must be embraced. There will be customers who will be willing to shell out the money to have something that is constructed using completely traditional techniques. But the majority of the world today is unaware of what is traditional and what looks traditional. In my opinion, the digital world would appreciate the complete hand craftsmanship quality of a traditional constructed item, but for many the pocket book is the deciding factor. Arch welders are not that much of a problem compared to some means of fabrication. What drives me up the wall are yard fences that are made of cast iron imitating forged iron work, and worse yet are the fabricated fences and driveway gates made from aluminum. I cant stand seeing those around town.
  22. In three dimensional design (sculpture) the "dies" or "faces" are called planes. They are defined by abrupt variations in direction. For example, a cylinder would have three definable planes. One Plane would be the top, one plane would be the bottom, and the side plane would be defined as one continuous plane. Planes are usually confused with lines. I have heard them compared as the following, "Think of the curves of a woman, not the lines of a car." The curves of a woman and the lines of a car are describing the planes present on the figure. Planes have a third z or depth axis, while lines simply have a height and width axis.
  23. Dies, hammer face, working surface, hardened cross section that impacts the thermally excited work piece resting upon the large mass of tool steel, or Jack. Which ever you like to call it, the question was really never answered. What would be the best surface to strike with and why?
  24. In my opinion, there are many reasons for the pain. As stated above it is most likely that you are jumping in all out trying to swing a hammer all day which might be too much for your body to handle. But because you can’t forge all day now does not mean you can build into it and get there in the future. The advice posted above is good, if it works for you. The main point is that there is no clear answer. I hate reading this myself, but you have to find what works for you. The way you swing the hammer will come with practice, just as running form comes from running hundreds of miles (the running example is because I run for my college). The way you hold the hammer depends on the anatomy of your hand. I have known smiths with small hands and they prefer smaller handles. I have large hands and like larger handles. The grip of the handle is something to consider, but yet again it depends on what you are doing and your anatomy. I have a very tight grip when I am hammering large stock with a heavy hammer (a loose grip would not control the hammer sufficiently), while at the same time I use a loose grip for more delicate procedures. As for the anvil height, again it depends on your style and anatomy. The knuckle height rule is an average. I have heard that it is because at that height the hammer face is parallel to the anvil face resulting in even forging. While this may be true, the wrist can account for that difference, if this is damaging to the wrist it is unknown to me. It is average because the lower extreme would be a striker’s anvil which is more on the knee level, and the upper extreme is the jeweler’s anvil about chest height. I am about 6' 4", but have the arms and torso of a 6' 6" man. I like the anvil height closer to wrist height than knuckle height. When I work at anvils of knuckle height I tend to bend over to see the metal, not because my eyes are bad but because I am just so far away from the anvil face. Wrist height works for me. In the past when I have had wrist pain it was usually caused by jumping right back into forging after months off being at college combined with using an oversized hammer. I noticed that it came when I was catching the hammer after it had rebound from the anvil, because of the weight I could not utilize the momentum to lift the hammer. I recovered by using a lighter hammer and really utilizing the rebound from the anvil. The best advice I have is to experiment. I started by placing the anvil on a chunk of wood and putting cinder blocks under it. The anvil was light so it was not a big deal to move and the cinder blocks could be easily moved to adjust the height. This type of stand would not hold up against daily use, but serves the purpose. The other advice is to use other shop's anvils. They will most likely have a different height than your set up. Be patient and don't be afraid to try something new. Research is never a bad thing. I will end with my thoughts of the Hofi hammer and technique. I believe it to be a brilliant marketing scheme. But in my opinion I do not like the way his hammer is designed or used. I do believe it to work well for him, but I do not want to buy a hammer that is well over $100 and designed to be used for pretty light stock. I think it works for him and what he does with the hammer, but it would not work for me. I just have a problem buying a hammer from a man who uses power hammers and presses for most of the large work. I still respect the man, and enjoy his work and believe him to be a very successful blacksmith. Just my opinion. As for helping with the pain, the best thing you can do is rest. Rest heals most injuries. I had a strained hamstring that lingered for 8 months and ruined my entire indoor and outdoor sophomore track season. That summer I finally just gave my hamstring a break and took about a month off from running. That is all it took. Any good physical therapist will all give the same advice no matter what the injury, ease into it. Don’t bite off more than you can chew, or else you will wind up in the same hole where you currently sit.
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