Avadon

That's what I'm trying to figure out where I might get that in central oregon. Hmm.. may have to phone book/ask/search to figure this out.

If you live in California you may have a good point. If you live in Alaska I don't think you'd want to walk constantly to your shop through -20dgs weather. Here in Central oregon it's pretty much the same thing. It's a place of extremes, cold and hot and not much in between. The mud room, though small, really allows the convenience of not having to go outside. It also acts as a very impressive firebreak. You can have shop walls that are fire rated, than both mud room walls are heavily fire rated. The chance of your shop catching your house on fire are probably less than just a 10' gap of air simply due to the imensity of all those fire proof materials. I've used attached and unattached shops and the attached shops are always nicer. If one is really concerned with fire issues, make the mud room longer between the shop and the house. You reduce risk by doing so.

This looks like good stuff, but I'm guessing no one has it locally. From a google search it doesn't appear to be at the big box home improvement stores (lowes/depot)

I'm foaming Closed Cell spray foam in my 24'x30' shop this wednesday and want to have the wall sheeting ready to cover the walls as soon as I'm able. That way I can get the surface mounted panel back in. I called the county just to see what the fire code is. They say 1/2" - (type x) gypsum is min code. Since I'm using this shop both as a smithy and minimally as a woodshop for the next year (until later it will be just a woodshop) I hadn't intended on sheeting with drywall. I guess with an attached building it's supposed to be drywall, regardless of how the building is attached. Even though I have a mudroom (10'x12') between house and shop that is drywall, the code says any building attached (even through other buildings) to a home must have drywall coverings. I just don't really know if I want to bother, honestly. Drywall in a smith is a curse, it gets busted, dinged, holes right through it, etc. Everyone here has seen that. My initial idea was 1/2" ply over the ceiling and two layers of 5/8's ply sandwiched with green glue for the walls (STC reasons). It seems like two layers of 5/8's ply would have quite a long burn time for a fire rating, but maybe not? Other thought I had was: 5/8's ply Green Glue 5/8's drywall 1/8'th ply vaneer or some other wood covering. Code said that drywall has to be the top layer, but clearly you see houses all the time that have wood on the walls, either T&G pine, cedar, or other type of coverings. And obviously all that is flammable. Having the 5/8's gypsum in there might crush between layers if I hang all my heavy objects on the wall. Even the 1/8th vaneer might also not really hold up very well either to heavy stuff hanging on the wall. Hence why my initial plan was the two layers of 5/8's ply. Clearly this is an annoying dilemma. I'm not having any inspections so it's not like someones coming to red flag me. I like the idea of safety, but if a safety measure ruins the use of the building then clearly that won't work. I also thought about two 5/8's ply sheets with steel or even stainless on the walls. Though when it comes to hanging anything on the walls that means drilling metal and you can't easily patch it if you move something from one place to another. The electrical is all surface mounted, nothing in the walls and I have numerous expensive smoke alarms w/ co detection as well as a co detector itself. Mud room also has smoke alarms. If I didn't have all my steel, tools and smithing stuff in there I wouldn't mind sheetrock at all. I just find it really hard to give into sheet rock knowing how awful it is in this circumstance. Penny for all your thoughts..

I don't know about getting involved with the firemarshall right off. I would call your local building department. They can point you to the building codes in your state and list all the things you have to comply to in order to meet code. The reason I say this is they are building inspectors, so they actually know everything, by law, that needs to be done to a building for it to comply with all the fire-safety codes. They are not just guessing as to what is or is not dangerous based on their own experience. Also you can call them and they'll answer all your questions and it's not like they're the gestapo and going to come down and redflag you. They don't do that. They just tell you what the code (laws) are and what is required whether you do them or not is your business. If you need to be inspected for insurance reasons or for the landlords or other reasons or just trying to comply completely with all regulations, I would certainly start with the county. If they give you a pass then any fire inspector that looks at it won't have much to say. They will tell you things like what kind of windows you need(and their fire rating), what kind of sheet rock (usually a minimum of 1/2 type x gypsum, taped and mudded), what kind of doors and their fire rating and also what type of egress you need. Whether you need more than one exist from where the forge is, etc. But anyway that's not my 2cents. Don't fear your local bldng department. They're not evil, they just are there to tell you the law, prevent you from injuring yourself or others and make sure you do it right the first time. If you decide to not comply, that's at your own risk. But always better to know and not comply then not know you're not even complying lol

This is also one of the better links I've found over the years... http://www.specjm.com/files/pdf/wood_framing.pdf John mansville specs on wall systems and their STC Class value.

Thanks for chiming in Bruno, hopefully we can start a serious trend of wearing these things. I think we would dramatically cut down E.R. visits and respiratory diseases.

You're right to be concerned with the walls. That's where the buck, or sound stop's in this case. The higher the STC (sound transmission class) rating of your walls then less your neighbors will hear. Essentially you'll turn your shop into a theatre by using a wall system that deadens and reduces sound in a fairly broad decible range. Start here http://www.soundproofingcompany.com/soundproofing101/ and read everything under the section Sound proofing 101 Then go here and read more http://soundisolationstore.com/research/ This will give you a fairly good start on understanding how to build a wall system that isolates sound. Check this out as well http://www.soundisolationcompany.com/education/soundproofing-101/best-wall-soundproofing I don't reccomend single wall on any exterior bldng. That obviously does nothing. A staggered stud wall or double stud wall is what you'll be looking at. They are not difficult to construct and if you use the homes garage you can build this feature into an existing building. I.E my home I bought had a 3 car garage with 2x4 walls, 16O.C. so I just put 2x4's between the 16" studs (after furring out the bottom and top plates) and then I had a beautiful 2x6 wall system with 2x4 staggered studs every 8" (8" O.C). In a theatre you'd use two layers of drywall and probably resillient channel if you wanted to go all out. For smithing/workshop purposes don't do that. Instead use one to two layers of plywood on your interior with green glue between the two and Green Glue sealent around all the edges. Stagger your joints of course. Doing two layers of drywall gives you no structural support and you still really can't hang things on the wall and they still will get dented really easy so drywall in a shop is always a bad idea. The green glue between the layers actually helps quite a bit, especially in a staggered stud scenario. Of course the real holy grail is decoupling the wall completely in a double wall system. But you do give up a lot of space in that system, that's why I didn't do it in 24' x 30' shop. Most experts say fiberglass in the void..... meh.. that's OK if you don't need much R value (i.e california or florida). Up here in Oregon I'm putting 5" of Closed Cell foam. Bad part of that is the foam acts like one big volume and somewhat decreases the benefit of the staggered studs, but not considerably. Therefore a lot of truists would say do 3" of foam and 3" of fiberglass. Makes it hard for sound to travel through a void like that because sound doesn't do well skipping across different densities/mediums. 8" concrete walls filled with sand would also do great (though pricey $$). That offers a lot of mass which helps considerably. You can even build a single stud wall in front of it as your first line of defense. If you have more questions I'm always here to help. If you don't get my attention just PM me.

Did you get some housewrap (WRB) over the OSB before you put on the siding? If not.. eeeeek :- that could come back to bite you. You're going to have a lot of fun in that little shop! Looks good.

Put them together and it looks like this This is a 3M model, but I can't vouch that it fits under your welding helmet because I haven't used this model. It may?

I'm not on iforgeiron much these days because I'm framing my workshop but my local welding supply company OxArc (Bend,OR) started carrying these respirators. I've already used it and wondered why it took me so long to know these things existed. I felt I had to tell others about this right away!! This respirator is so handy it should come with every welding helmet sold. It could save your life! RESPIRATOR: NORTH 7700Series Silicone Half Mask (www.northsafety.com) Model 770030M Cartridges: Honeywell 75FFP100 NIOSH P100 W522935 www.honeywellsafety.com These cartridges have female threads on the back and they screw into the respirator above (you remove the larger cartridges. These flat, disc shaped cartridges work just as well. I tested them in the store with a smoke-irritant test kit. Amazing just how well they work. Over the last several years ventilation in one shop or another has always been an issue and since most of us don't have thousands to drop on expensive ventilation or point extraction systems this is a cheap no brainer. All in the setup is only $25-$30. Fits perfectly under my welding helmet and I now can weld on metals that have paint/glue/etc. on them that pour off smoke and I get none of it in me. I really wish I would have known about these years ago!! I emplore you to get them. I'm sure you can find this setup on ebay or amazon. No amount of fans or open windows will ever work like this will. It's also about 1/2 as light as your standard respirator so it's great when doing wood working, sanding, drywall, etc. in addition to welding. The only caveat is that it's for dust/particulate and what they call "nuisance level smoke." It's not to be used to protect from heavy metals and it's not for welding galvanized. So if you do a lot of welding on painted things or even a lot of welding in a tight shop this should be on your face. No more fume fever! :-)

I'm going to throw out my 2 cents for whatever it's worth. I have a background in carpentry, cabinet making, woodworking, etc. which came before the blacksmithing and I've also done some framing of buildings. I'm also interested primarily in doing blades and armor and migrating from the welding/smithing I've done and still am doing to the former mentioned. First thing I would ask is are you renting or do you own? If you own I would do it right and do it once. That being a traiditional tier 1 workshop. In this economy you can get 20x30 shops framed up pretty cheaply, even cheaper if you do it yourself. The most expensive part will be concrete and aside from the concrete you can build as you go/have the money. It's not that much work to put up a 20x30 (or smaller) and throw up T-111 siding. Contractors can practically sneeze these buildings out with their eyes shut and you can too with a little research and even a small bit of help. But if you want something NOW I really like the idea of a pre-fab carport. You can usually find these on craigslist. You can sheet off/close it up and probably even tie in some insulation into it. It would at least give you a temporary place. Another idea is built yourself a small shop. A great book "Build Your Own Shed" by HDA Inc. I think I got it at Lowes or Home Depot. Sure you can find it on Amazon or ebay for cheap and have it shipped to you. Great hands on little book that will walk even a total newb through framing a small building. I have the book and it's great. Yet another excellent idea.. build this really cool small gambrel shed yourself from Barn Plans http://www.barnplans.com/minibarn.php The guy who owns this company is named Dano. He's super cool, easy to talk to on the phone, doesn't mind answering lots of questions and he's based here in Oregon (where I am) but out by the coast. They've had hundreds of these barns built (in many of his different sizes) and you can build a concrete floor or put it on skids, or probably even do sand or gravel floor. Just ask Dano, he's a licensed architect and pretty good with engineering too. Then later when you build a much larger shop you can use it to house your gardening tools-lawn mower/armouring/Blacksmithing storage. Yet even another option is to buy a pre-made shed. Tons of people sell these, not just lowes/home depot, but you can find lots of companies that deliver them or even come out and build them. At my parents house they built me one for working on my hobbies (back then R/C Sailplanes) and the crew came out and framed the thing completely in under 3 hours. The previous day we had poursed a slab for it and had angle iron to attach to the skids. So when they put those skids down the workers drilled the concrete and put in anchors then put in lags through the angle iron into the P.T skids. That thing never budged a bit. It's still there 25 years later!! These small sheds go for about 2k-5k. They have these things so competitive that you probably couldn't build it yourself for that cheap, especially considering your time/labor. You may even be able to find one on cragslist used that someone just wants hauled away. Getting it up onto a flat bed trailer though and back down can be an ordeal in itself, but if you buy the thing for a few hundred could be worth it. Some guys love pole barns and that's cool. I myself can't stand them because the timber is quite heavy for one guy to raise. They aren't terribly easy to raise in my opinion and insulating them can be tricky since you don't have 16" bays to easily throw fiberglass into. In Jefferson County, Oregon they are considered a Tier II building since they are cheaper to build. A Tier I building being traditional stick frame. That said, pole bldngs are cheaper on your property taxes, but they also don't appreciate your house value as much as a stick bldng. I'm not big on having PT wood in concrete either like in pole bldngs, if something has to be replaced it's a big chore. But there are tons of pro's and con's and that's an entire thread within itself. Everyone is right about your thermal issues (if you don't use any insulation). Without insulation the time you will feel comfortable in your shop will probably be only 2-3 months of the year at most. I know because I am prepping my uninsulated 24x30 shop for C.C. Spray Foam and whatever the temperature is outside in the summer you'll have that temp and 5-10degrees hotter. So if it's 100dgs out, it could be 110 in your shop. I experienced just such an event in my shop this last summer. It functions like a greenhouse/convection oven. Roof shingles heat up the OSB, OSB and T-111 transmit all that heat energy right into the interior and dramatically increase the temperature inside the building. By noon you'll have an oven. Welding in that shop meant drenching my clothes in water, wringing them out, and putting them back on. Only way to avoid heat exhaustion. When you're buidling anywhere near/close to a fence make sure you research your set back's. Fences are usually built an inch or two set in from your property line. Most counties dictate that any structure must be placed so many feet in from the property line. Here in my part of central oregon any building (of I believe any size) must be set back 15' from the property line. I liev in some rural country so there is plenty of room. Some tight suburbs may be as little as 10'. You'll definitely want to call the counties bldng department and find this out even if you put the bldng on skids. You'll still level and tamp the earth and perhaps place iton tamped gravel for proper drainage. Even small shops can't be moved very easily (think F-150 truck, bobcat or forklift). Hope at least some of this helps?

If it's going to be in earth you'll definitely need stirrups in concrete or Pressure treated 4x4's set in concrete, akin to a pole barn. But if it's not sheeted then I wouldn't think you need to anchor it to earth. In that case I woud just by some Pressure Treated 2x6's and run those along the bottom and let the whole thing sit on those. I wouldn't think you would need a permit for this since it probably wouldn't be considered a structure as it doesn't have a foundation, but if you have nosy/persnickity neighbors who you think are going to give you a problem you might want to call your local bldng dept just to check. Where I live in Oregon I believe it's any structure under 140sq feet (or something like that) doesn't require a permit. My bigger concern with the design would be theft of your tools :(

Excellent David.. that pic is worth a thousand words because i didn't understand how you were using the angle iron. I've done this carpentry before in woodshop with biscuits. I like the idea of using a plywood behind the boards to keep them oriented. I live in very dry country (high desert) so I don't think there will be warpage from weather. But I'll definitely go with the air dried oak.

Thanks for all this information guys. I'm going to use this all as a springboard into deeper research. I'll definitely post my doors when they are done!! Cheers. :)

I want a modern door that looks medieval, heavy duty, can resist burglary (so it has to have a keyed lock/latch, a cavity for filling with insulation (probably spray foam) and that's about it. I'm thinking some kind of oak frame cavity, faced with oak, spray foam in the middle, and the back (inside shop) with oak running the other direction or diagnol? Am I way off?

I didn't think by posting the picture people would be so concerned with THAT picture. It probably is a cheesy modern knock off. I'm asking in the general sense about these types of doors. If you go to google and type in medieval door you can see hundreds of them, the vast bulk of them authentic or exceedingly well created replicas. I just grabbed a picture at random that had the studs on the door. Now here is the million dollar question. Does anyone have any good construction tutorials on building these types of doors? Any carpenters who can walk me through the process?

Thanks Vaughn, interesting input on the subject. I suppose the way the studs are laid out it would make a direct swing with an axe likely to hit one of the studs. I couldn't seem to find many pictures of the studs where they were put vertically in line. That makes me think that the diagonal pattern was used specifically to stop people from trying to cut through the door. The hinges probably also helped this. However, I tend to agree with you that the big hinges and some of the more embellished layouts had far more to do with wealth, class, and style then it did for security. I saw one door that looked like it had metal straps laid horizontally across it and they were overlapping. Straps were secured with studs. Now clearly something like that was definitely guarding a vulnerable entry and done for security and certainly not for looks. Or at least it didn't appear that way to me from the picture I saw. I saw those studs on a website for about $2.68 USD a piece. That doesn't seem so bad until you realize some of those doors had hundreds on them. :o Plus custom hinges, plus wood and it all skyrockets into big cost fairly quickly, even if you're making them with modern equipment. Any idea what the wood was used back then? and what might be used to day for recreation of such doors? was it maple? oak? cherry?

I read on google "A typical exterior wooden Door might be made out of two layers of oak planks. The grain of the wood would run vertically on the front layer and horizontally on the back, like a simple form of plywood. The two layers would be held together by iron studs, and the structure might be strengthened and stiffened with iron bands. The studs themselves were pointed on the front so that attackers would damage their weapons (swords, axes, etc.) while trying to break through." So is this really what medieval studs were basically for, to #1 secure laminated boards and #2 stop people from breaking through with an axe? Or was it also for decorative purpose? Can anyone tell me more about these types of spikes? Also were the hinges to work as a preventative measure as well? thanks :)

You can also scan them in, and use photoshop to edit out the blue/green graph lines. That's especially important if you need to submit them for professional review.

That's very smart. I did that with my property a few months ago so I could see just how the buildings layed out. It really did help me visualize the size and scale of everything.

That's what I did. I moved to the far southern end of a very rural county. At the far southern end of my county is where the other county is that has the closest big city. So I get the lax zoning laws and the closeness 15 mins to the city.You can't beat it. Yes sure there are some statewide zoning issues and I do have a very easy going HOA, but in all living on these 1-5 acre parcels in oregon you can get away with things that you couldn't even dream of if you lived in the suburbs. Plus you can build a perimeter property privacy fence, then no one really knows what you're doing behind that and only way you could get in trouble is if a neighbor narc'd on you and my neighbors are all doing their own thing. lol So for example I'm rebuilding the inside of my own shop without a permit. I probably don't even need a permit in my county (not changing structure and I know what I'm doing), but in another county I'm sure I would, in fact on day 2 a neighbor would have called the county to report my building noise. That's just one thing about being out in the country that is awesome. Neighbors tend to be friendlier and more easy going, everyone has enough space to do whatever they want, noise issues aren't as big of a deal, etc. I had an excavator out on my property and I was digging all over the place, ripping trees out and going crazy. No one batted an eye. In fact they wanted to know if i could help them on their property with the excavator. If I did that in the burbs I'd probably be in the back of squad car. Or at the very least have people demanding to see permit/construction papers. When I bought my place I realized that traditionally blacksmiths have been where the horses have been as farriers and blacksmiths have gone hand in hand throughout the age. Well, all the horses are way out in the country with the wide open space. Ergo, find a place out where the horses are you'll have the wide open space and lot of lee way and tolerance for your trade. And it turned out I was right about that presumption. People out here are excited to know I'm a blacksmith. In the suburbs they looked at me like I said I was building a nuclear testing facility in the backyard. All they could envision was noise, fire danger, smoke, disturbance etc. IMO It's when people are packed in like sardines in the burbs that trying to do anything other than standard fair can get you into hot water.

What an awesome shop!!! Love the dragons and the exterior metalwork. Totally sweet. I'm shop building myself: a 24x36 building which is a full staggered stud construction. Feels like I've spent a lifetime installing studs, it's as much wood as two buildings would be, all in one floor print but it should aid in dampening sound. I'll have pics here soon. Behind this shop I plan a future shop that is 36x68' gambrel. Good thing you chose the 36' width. Hopefully you can go longer should you ever need to.

Now that makes sense why they were all maxed out at 450cfm in the 4" impellers on ebay. Thanks for all this good information.

That thing looks incredibly heavy and stout. I imagine if you drop it on your foot it is game over!