Paragon

Thanks, gents.

I will have to make another and try some scrolling pliers on the edges of the pedals. I decided to leave these one as is when I was making it.

Good tip. The typical 3-4-5 right triangle.
Carpenters use that to square up framing. Measure 3' down one side, 4' down the other and the diagonal between the points should be 5' to be square. Can also do any multiple like 6-8-10 or use inches or centimeters.

Another easy tip for square up a frame (given parallel sides are the same length) is to measure the diagonals and they should be the same.

Keep the tips coming! The simple solutions are sometimes the one's we forget!

Well, here it is. This is the rose I mentioned in a few other posts. My first blacksmithing (if you can call it that). I gave the rose to my Mom for Christmas.



(new camera so focus is a little off)

Rose: 1" & 1 1/4" square tubing. Stem: 1/8"x1/2" hot roll. Leaf: 3/8" cold roll square. Brass wire wheel in the angle grinder and a coat of Beeswax (propane heated).
I worked on it for 3 days so I do not know how long it actually took me but I know a second one would be a lot less time.
No forge - oxy-acetylene torch for heating. No anvil - 6" block of steel for the flat, 11" long 3/4" diameter center punch (pointed chisel) and the handle end of a 5' long prybar 1" (might be 1 1/4") diameter for the horn. I eventually rounded the end of the large prybar to aid in shaping the bud. Had all the hammers I will probably ever need - most used was the cross-peen and the ball-peen. I used the cross-peen and the edge of the prybar for starting the fullering and finished with the shaft of a bolt (1/2" diameter ?)
Fullering wasn't too bad. Localizing the heat to the ring and frequent turning left the rose undistorted for the most part.

Also, after I finished with the inner bud, my brother wanted to make one for his girlfriend so I helped him in the middle of working on mine. He did really well (helped I just made on so it was a lot easier to guide him) and it only took us about three hours. I helped with fullering, used a section of stem I had, touched up the leaf a little and did the welding for him. Brass wire wheel in the angle grinder and a quick spray of satin clear. (can't even tell the leaf fell off the stem a few times )
Bud: 1" square tubing. Stem: 1/8"x1/2" hot roll. Leaf: 3/8" cold roll square
(phone picture)



Anyhoo, I'm hooked.
I was lucky to have the materials around (have other welding projects going)
Next rose will be a Russian rose. Next project, not sure but I have ideas. Might have to finish up the welding projects first. I'm to the point that I rather make gifts than buy them. Only trouble is time. I have a while for a wedding gift at least.

Thanks for looking.. and for the new hobby.

Wow. Lots of replies. Thanks to all who posted.
I would make my own but I'm not sure how hard it would be with no anvil and no forge.

I have been looking for the cheapies to modify (non as cheap as I would like) so was just wondering what is out there. I totally forgot about the BlackSmithdepot. I'll check out the other places, too.
Bill, thanks for the info. I will check into it. Sounds like a deal.

Where can I get a nice pair of round nose pliers. Looking for all metal heavy duty so they can take the heat. The only ones I can seem to find are for crafts, small, and have plastic/rubber handles.

Below is what I am looking for.

link removed at the request of anvilfire

Thanks for the heads up.
George.

Take your TV remote.. and your cell phone camera (other digital camera with LCD screen may work too) and point the remote at the camera lense and press a button.. you will see the IR LED light up and blink.

I use my shade 5 OA goggles sometimes when I'm heating up. I think I need to use it more. (doesn't help I use the OA torch for heating) Might get one that has the flip up lense so I can see easier when hammering.

You can see the steel start to get glossy then it goes liquid. Easy to see with the shade 5. Just remember that things are hotter than they appear through the goggles.

One more thing.. I was in the chatroom Tuesday and asking about a few things and everyone was very kind and helpful. We got into forges and it was very informative. It is nice to see that everyone didn't mind a newbie coming in and asking questions.

Thanks.

I just want to say that this site has been wonderful as I am getting into smithing.

I helped my older brother make a rose last night (first time he has mashed glowing steel) and he is talking about 'next time' and 'next year' already. The rose turned out great and my bro did most of the work. There were a few times I took the hammer to give the piece a little more brute force (bro is a less accurate and more awkward with the hammer than I) to help him but for the most part, he forged most of the bud and the leaf. He was getting tired by the time we got to the stem so we used a bit that I was working on earlier. I welded the whole thing up and brushed it and now we just need to shoot it with clear. I will be posting pics of his rose and the rose I am making for Mom.

Anyhoo.. where was I.. I enjoyed seeing him liking the smithing and I think he was impressed with himself when we finished. This site (and anvilfire) has enabled me to do something that I enjoy and also lit the pilot light in my brother so thanks to all who contribute.
I wouldn't worry too much about one person's input but it would be cool to get it back (if someone wanted to spend the time - I could if I had the information and ability on the site)

Everyone also needs to remember that whenever you are chatting (especially on the internet) you will find people that have different opinion than you. Take it only as far as the chair you sit in right now. Don;t let it eat you all day. Things pass with time.. it was unfortunate that Alan (never knew him.. but a mind mine for input nonetheless) took it too personal with a closed mind. If you post on the internet, you must have an open mind.

I think I said what I wanted to say.. mainly "thanks" for the great resource. I will post pics (might have to be after christmas) as I know we all love pics.

Wow.. what a collection. Feels like I am going through a museum.

I would think that if you make a jig where you could slip the end of the angle in and wrap it around.. Like a typical scrolling jig but the contact edge would have that 72 deg angle on it. Just bend and hammer it to hold the angle? (Beware, I have not done any scrolling so this is just off the top of my head.. or perhaps near the middle.. somewhere in there.)

If it were mine, I would leave it as is and make a square hardy that has sharp edges and a flat top (has anyone actually ever done this?). You never know when a good round corner can come in handy

Just my unskilled thought. My current anvil is a block of steel (~ 5"x5"x6") and use a second chunk on top at times (~ 2.5"x2.5"x7") So almost anything is better than that. Also have another block with many holes in it.. one just happens to be able to hold a chisel. Oh. my forge.. an Oxy/acetylene torch in my right hand. Still want to get a piece or train rail.
All I have done is twist a square bar 1/4 turn and make my first leaf.

One of the main things to understand with acetylene is that you can only use it at a rate of 1/7 the volume of the tank. What I mean is that if you have the smaller 40 cubic foot tank, then you can only withdraw up to 1/7th that per hour (about 5.7 cubic feet per hour)
I bought a Victor SuperRangeII kit and got a #00 tip instead of the #2 that comes with it.

Using Aceylene is all about numbers..

If you look at the documents below, you can see what size tips you can use by looking at the SCFH figure for Acetylene. The #0 cutting tip I have I may be able to use if I keep the settings down but I will only be able to cut around 3/8" plate with the 40cf tank I have. If I wanted to cut anything thicker, either I would have to manifold tanks together or get a 80cf Acetylene tank.
The Main use in cutting is your oxygen. You can see that an 80cf oxygen will last for about an hour of cutting 3/4" steel. The acetylene flame is for your preheat only so it may be possible to cut thicker plates with patience. I have not tried any cutting yet so I do not know for sure.

Same goes with the welding. In order to get the heating and penetration of weld, I would probably have to get a larger tank if I wanted to do anything over 1/8" thick. From what I gather, this is assuming a complete weld all the way through in one shot. You can weld one side and flip the piece over and weld from that side to get the full penetration. I have welded 3/8" square solid to a few thing around the edge but I know it is not a deep weld. Only for a shelf so it doesn't need ot be strong.

http://www.thermadyne.com/victor/literature/pdfs/B_WeldNozzle_info.pdf
http://www.thermadyne.com/victor/literature/pdfs/D_Performance_Data.pdf

As for tanks.. Not sure what fittings you have over there. (would almost assume it is the standard over here so the companies can easily sell equipment there) but I have been welding for a month now, so all I know is from reading.

Any questions, let us know.

That is sime amazing skill there (the welding.. not the peeps)
If one swing missed the target, it would have been a busted leg or skull. So wish there was audio.

Good point. I did think of that before but the tracks here are bolted together. It may have been possible the rails were changed at one point but I doubt it. It may have been in the loads of rail rock that they spread around so it may not even be native to here but frome somewhere where thermite was used. I'll have to go meander about some more.

Kogatana,
Please don't take me wrong but From the questions you have asked it would probably be best it you signed up for a vocational course in basic welding, or at least found a local blacksmithing /metalworking group to join. They willl help you alot.
I'm not trying to discourage you but you will learn quicker and safer if you know the basics before you purchase your own equipment.

JWB

I agree. Firsthand experience with someone skilled looking over your shoulder is the best and safest way to start learning.
If you are doing a lot of pattern cutting, then a plasma cutter may be good.

I love the oxy-acetylene kit I bought recently even though I have only used it for welding. You can use it to heat, weld, cut, and braze dissimilar materials together. Be careful though, they are limited to the thickness that you can use them on by the capacity of the gas cylinders that you have. (Acetylene can be dangerous at pressure over 15 PSI past the regulator. Acetylene can not be used at a flowrate of more than 1/7 the capacity of the cylinder you are using so large nozzles on small tanks will not work - be sure to understand and follow the instruction booklet)

Where was I..

MIG is handy for the ease of being able to tack something fast (possible to do with O/A torch but not nearly as fast) Main lesson I learned when I used a MIG was to go slow.

TIG is handy for exotic metals like Al, Ti. Takes more skill than MIG to use.

I didn't have too much time with the TIG so I never got good at it but I think I learned to use the O/A torch for welding faster just because I did a lot of research and read many sources on technique - which my technique is still not the best but I can get nice welds for the most part.

At the moment, I think technique is everything. It pays to know what to look for in wrong technique and what to change to make it better.

Anyhoo.. enough rambling..

See the problem

I'll look further.....

Love it!

I was just wondering the other day what the purpose of a leg vise was.. now I know. Makes total sense to this engineer. Less force transmission through the bench.

Does anyone in the SE Michigan area know where to get iron bar/rod and small sections or railroad track? I live north of Detroit. Figured if I ever get into messin around a forge iron might be a good starter metal to bang around.

I was walking behind the yard after backingfilling a drain pipe and remembering the days when I was young(er) looking at the train tracks.. looked down and saw this..

A small fridge magnet will lightly attract to it so it must have some amount of iron in it - probably not enough to mess around with. Wondering what it is from though. Possibly from the coal burning locomotive days?

Anyhoo. just thought I'd share. Love the forum!

Howdy. Happened by this site a week ago while I was dreaming about doing some blacksmithing. I'm not a blacksmith or any sort and have only started to do some metalwork with an oxy-acetylene torch set (eventually want to braze a lug bike frame together.. but I digress)

Anyhoo.. saw your post and wanted to suggest you take a look at "modular spiral staircases" (google it up) Spiral staircase and modular staircase kit products (has installation videos also)
They are simple construction where each tread is separate and has a heavy tube attached. This is your main support for the treads. The tube usually slides over a central pole. There is usually a small connection at the outer circumference between treads to hold them in place. This design keeps the outer circumference very light as there is is not a heavy helical beam there.
It appears some rely on the railing for support also (at least on that linked site)

I saw one being installed many years ago on TV (I'm a This Old House type person)

Anyhoo.. good luck in your venture.