Starting out

[sinpwnzorz]

Okay I've been doing lots of research, I see tons of different tools being used for tons and tons of different appliations. My question to you all is what is the first thing I should make? 

I have: Anvil, Forge, Hammer, 1 set of tongs.

I am wondering what the evolutionary progression of tools is like. Should I make a Hardy cutoff tool first? different tongs? special hammer?

Alot of these things need specific tools to make, but it almost seems like you need the tool to make the tool you're making. Can anybody shed some light on this?

[Frosty]

You start off learning the processes not making tools. Some tools are entirely basic processes but they turn out much better if you learn the process first. For example a hot chisel is just a spread draw on one end, heat treat, a little grinding and done. Easy peasy, IF you know how to do a spreading draw and heat treat. Heat treatment is NOT an early beginner's process.

How's your hammer control? Making nails is good practice for moving fast and good control but you'll need a header so you'll need to punch a hole, so you'll need a punch, forge an even round taper, a little grinding and heat treat. Yeah, heat treating again.

On and on, there are a lot of processes and techniques you need to know before tricks will even help.

As a start the guys like to start students out with long even tapers and simple bends, S hooks are popular. Two life long necessary techniques in one project. Then once a student is making reasonably consistent S hooks we'll throw in a twist. Technique 3. Now we're getting into drive hooks or maybe coat hooks. A coat hook involves counter sinking and punching screw holes so it's time to make a couple punches but you've had some time at the fire and anvil so judging heat and timing are easier.

Don't think I'm trying to discourage you, I'd much rather you succeed in learning this craft, it's just involved and takes practice.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Randy Bill]

Make your forge "tools" first. All the stuff to manage the fire; poker, rake, scoop, water sprinkling can. Then something to organize them, then you'll want to re-do the handle portion of the tools just made, then...

[Quarry Dog]

You might also have Ideas of minor "improvements" that could make the tool work better for you, or at least look better.  Just don't be surprised if you go to the trouble to make a tool with said improvements, and it doesn't work like you planned.

[ThomasPowers]

Since all you will be doing is farrier work all you need to make is farrier tools (and tools to make farrier tools)

I mean since all you will be doing is knifemaking all you need to make is knifemaking tools---tempering tongs for example.

Since what you will be doing is something YOU have not shared with US; asking US what YOU need to make is a waste of bits!

[Old South Creations]

If you already have an anvil, forge, hammer, & tongs you're already ahead of the game compared to most 'beginners'. I second what Frosty said,...hooks ("S", "J", and drive hooks) make great beginner projects and they're useful! Nails are a good project as well but you'll have to make or buy a header. I wish you good luck!

[Jacob Nothstine]

I would pick up a copy of "The Backyard Blacksmith" By: Lorelei Sims a lot of good information, also has projects for beginners.  Once you start making stuff you will find out quick what tools you need. 

[Charles R. Stevens]

Punch, chisel, rivet hedder, more tongs. You need special tongs to forge hardy tools. 

[Gumbatron]

I can identify with the situation the OP is describing. As a beginner myself it can be a bit daunting to know what to do first. 

Luckily, I have access to some basic tools and very well set up Forge via a local artist blacksmith shop that is set up as a bit of a community blacksmithing center (rent a forge).

My plan, not saying this is the ONLY way to go, is to start by making only the tools I need to get the job done. I will have a couple of hammers (one bought, one found) and that's about it. My current plan is to start making some bottle openers (with any luck, I might be able to post a photo of one in a few weeks :-)). For that I will need to punch/slit a hole. So first tool I'll need will be a punch and/or a slitting punch. I'll also need a bob punch for the little tab. I can probably borrow some tongs for a while, but a basic pair of tongs will also be on the list.

These punches will then be the first things (other than some random stuff (Tapers, S hooks, twists, etc) I did in the beginners course offered by the blacksmithing center). These tools will likely not be the finest examples of their type and may not work as well as ones made by experienced smiths. But the point of making them is to start to get experience. Try making tools, see if they work and learn from the mistakes I'll almost certainly make.

While I would love a hot cut hardie of my own, that's a fair way down the path at the moment. My advise would be to have a go at it, but start with modest and simple tools. Of course, I'm not exactly speaking from experience though, rather more from the shared and palpable anticipation of experience I'm yet to gain. The sage advice of others with experience is definitely worth taking.

 

Cheers,

    Gumbatron

[Charles R. Stevens]

Easy first cut off hardy can be fabricated from a peice of leif spring, forged or cut to fit the hardy hole diaginaly, wish I new that befor I forged down a sucker rod knuckle (threads up). 

Seriusly tho, the tools to make tongs, then the tongs them selves are the place to start. BTW, I forgot the drift ;-)

Edited July 16, 2015 by Charles R. Stevens

[ThorsHammer82]

A hot cut can be as simple as a edged piece of iron bolted to the side of the anvil stand. It doesn't need to be heat treated as it would loose it's heat treatment due to the type of use it will see. It can also be something that is put in a vice while you're cutting and removed when you don't need it. Just like bending forks, fullering tools, guillotine tools, etc. etc. etc. anything that can go in a hardy hole, can be made to work with a vice as well. So if you're anvil poor like I am, and don't have a hardy hole to work with, you use what you have to make what you need while you search for what you want and then the cycle continues.

As stated above. tapers, S/J hooks, scrolls and twists are the best places to start. Square up round stock. round up square stock, taper both round and square stock, bend both round and square, and flat stock, twist square stock. Make a leaf, draw out the pedal and the stem.

Punches, drifts and slits are going to be the easiest tools to make. Heat treating being the hardest part of those. the tools need to make them are a hammer an anvil and a file/grinder.

Then you'll want/need tongs. tools = Hammer, anvil, punch/drill.

after that it's just a matter of making the tools the right size/shape to make what you're trying to make. You'll notice that most smiths who've been in the craft for a while have more sizes of the same tool than they have different tools in the shop.

a drift is a drift, but you can have dozens of different sized drifts. A set of tongs is a set of tongs, but you can have dozens of different sizes/shapes of tongs. A hammer is a hammer, but you can have dozens of different sizes/combinations of hammers.

[the iron dwarf]

use an old axe as a hot cut, place it on the hot metal which is on any suitable block of steel ( not the face of your anvil ) and strike the back with a hammer

[Steve Sells]

my First hot cut was 2 inch angle Iron about 2 inch wide, with a 3/8 bolt threw one side to be held by the pritchel hole for use, even this mild steel held up ok against hot metals

[ThomasPowers]

for a handled hotcut I've seen an old hatchet used

[Frosty]

When using a hot cut remember to lay a piece of mild steel on the anvil's face to protect the cut and face.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Michael Cochran]

for a handled hotcut I've seen an old hatchet used

A hatchet was the first thing I had to use. Then I got a cheapo cold chisel I used for a while.

[WL smith]

All of the above advice is good. But the most important part is HAVE FUN DOING IT.

[Everything Mac]

The very first things you should be making are the tools for your fire as Randy Bill says. Make a poker, a rake and have a crack at a shovel. None of these have to be very fancy, but these are the tools you will be using every time you work at the forge. I still use the rake I made almost 7 years ago. 

As I say, none of these tools need to be fancy at all. You could just take a length of square or round - forge a point on it then bend the other end a bit to make the handle and thats the job done. 

Basically these tools serve as a way for you to practice techniques whilst getting something practical back from it. Once you've made your first set - make another set in a years time, those ones will be better. 

 

As the Iron Dwarf points out you can use an old axe for a hot cut, or do what I used to do and use an old brick chisel that slots into my hardy hole. 

Rushing out and forging a pair of tongs as your first project is like trying to run before you're eating solid food... To me that would be a fast way to frustration and failure. 

Once you've made your fire tools, post it here and we'll give you pointers. And remember none of us are master blacksmiths to start out. Every member here has a pile of burnt up, misshapen mistakes we don't show to the public. 

Watch this video with Kim Thomas: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSTAKPjEun8

And if you can afford it - buy the books by Mark Aspery - "Mastering the Fundamentals of Blacksmithing" 

 

Andy

[gabe4183]

Dont ask steve sells anything he will make you cry your pants and quit forging for 2 years :*(

I live in a area where finding training or other blacksmiths seems impossible -- I learn by seeing it. Theoretically I know most forging basic and intermediate forging techniques; however i quit due to over frustration and repeated failures. SO, i would suggest tackling simple projects where you can achieve success. Rounding squaring tapering etc master all those and find a project that involves all of those techniques and practically apply it.

In my mind seeing a guy make it in person one time would save me years of research so that would speed up your learning curve 10 fold. ALot of these guys get the same vague questions over and over i suppose get annoyed because the communication barrier is there for some folks.

Im back to hammering as soon as i get my set up moved --- so here to xxxx off some more Steve

Personal attacks are against the site guidelines.

 

[Charles R. Stevens]

Eh, Steve thrives on teaching, and part of that is doing homework. 

[mitch4ging]

sinp,

You did not put where you are from. You can look up a blacksmith group in your area and join up, then you can get real time help and advise. Try looking up ABANA-chapter.com for a list of groups, plus a list here on ifi. Get togethers are alway a blast! 

[mitch4ging]

gabe,

personal attacks don't help anyone.

A quick google search and the albana-group listing shows 2 groups in NC, an ALBANA chapter and Falling Creek blacksmith guild. You may have to drive a little, but it's worth it to get the over the shoulder and hands on time.  Plus usually some good feed! :o)

[Charles R. Stevens]

That could pass as a freindly jab around these parts, Steve is pretty thick skined

 

[ThomasPowers]

We used to carpool from Columbus OH to Troy OH for the SOFA meetings; great fun on the trip as well as the meeting.  Best way to find other people is to attend the "local" meeting and ask who lives out your way.

[gabe4183]

Johnson C smith Blacksmithing school in brasstown is like a 5-6 hour drive for me. Im sure there's bound to be people closer but they arent searchable on the web. Ive secretly been wanting to save up some money and take Brian Brazeals couple day course to get a kick start of knowledge.  But I had no intentions of hijacking a post I was just giving some advice.