Quarry Dog Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 You're definitely starting to get the geometry down. Keep working at it, and then when you're where you want to be, come back and fix all the ones that you can and you'll have a bunch of tongs to fit for different stock sizes/shapes. I would definitely not throw these ones in the scrap bin just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 I didn't plan on scrapping the yet. Even if I don't ever get around to making them usable I'll probably keep them. Then when my son gets older if he decides to take an interest in smithing I can show him a progression. I know seeing that right from the start would've helped me some. I started down this slippery slope because I saw somethin on tv that caught my attention. Next thing I know I watched hours of videos on YouTube where so many people make it look deceptively easy. I know better now, obviously, but my failures could be good teaching tools later on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 You should try and learn to make tongs when your instructor is left handed and you are right handed. LOL I just kept screwing up in class over and over. I'd manage to get down to the last step, and roll the tongs the wrong way and screw it all up. Same thing happened later when I tried at home to do it myself. Then one day it hit me what the problem was. The fact Warren was left handed and rolled his tongs the opposite way I would, so using his blank as an example was backwards to how I needed to do them. DUH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quarry Dog Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 It doesn't really matter which way, so long as you do them both the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Trez Cole Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 improving every time make them make tongs ten times and you will get it. Do it 100 times and you find a better way to do it. Check you working temperature. You have a cold shunt right behind the boss. Also check the radius of the edge of your anvil to sharp of a corner can cause problems as well. you are on the right path. Do not be OCD every thing you make will not be perfect. To much time heating the metal and to hot can work against you. Try some 1045 steel that is what the professional tong maker use. 3/4" is a real good size. Also do not complete each step first heat set up you jaw, Boss,and reins next heat go back and refine them work it a little at a time to keep the balance. Flat jaw tongs the jaws should be tapered not flat. You want thickness where the jaw meets the boss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 Thanks everyone for your tips and comments. I haven't taken the time as yet to try anymore. Things have just been a little too hectic lately but that'll change soon and I'll be able to get back in the shop for another go.I still haven't figured out how to get steel from the local supplier when they close at 3:30 in the afternoon and I'm still at work for at least an hour after that most days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judson Yaggy Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 If they close at 3:30 then they probably open at 7 or before, call and ask if anyone is ever there early. Most folks make exceptions for cash customers.Francis spotted and mentioned the cold shut. Could also be from fullering too deeply with a narrow fuller or sharp anvil edges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Have it delivered to work possibly. Depending what you do for a living, some places don't mind an occasional personal delivery at work. If that isn't an option, maybe it can be delivered to someone else you know who will take the delivery during working hours.Some places are willing to set stuff out for customers who have paid in advance. A few have a special spot set aside for stuff like this, others will just put it behind the building or out of sight. You of course take the risk some one will grab it before you do however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 Their hours are from 6am-330 and its about a 45 drive from work where I have to be at 630. I'll try calling and see if I can pay over the phone and get an after hours pickup. Delivery to work can't happen since I don't know where I'm gonna work from day to day. Lately we've been about 90 minutes drive the opposite direction so that's a no go. I'll figure somethin out.as far as the cold shuts, I marked the bar cold with a chisel and then used my anvil edges to set the fullers. The corners are a little sharp but since I'm new to using an anvil I haven't figured out how to round it any. To be honest I haven't really looked hard to find that answer yet. I have some old files that are almost no good I might try to use. Thanks for pointing out the anvils edge as a likely and embarrassingly obvious reason to that problem. I'm not sure why I didn't think about that myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quarry Dog Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 You might be surprised how well soapstone holds up in the fire, at least well enough to put a good fuller mark in. A lot less chance of getting a cold shut, depending on how deep you're marking it with the cold chisel (I know I've done it.) A light centerpunch mark works well too, if your eyes are up for it, and that doesn't go away unless you burn it off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) I chiseled about 1/16" deep which is just enough I can feel it as i take it back and forth over the edge of the anvil. I've tried soapstone but once the metal starts glowing I don't see my mark anymore, it might just be my bad eyes. I can't read a speed limit sign at 30 yards, if I take my glasses off I don't even see the sign I've seen people use the centerpunch method and I guess it's time to give it a try. Edited July 1, 2015 by M Cochran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 I chiseled about 1/16" deep which is just enough I can feel it as i take it back and forth over the edge of the anvil. I've tried soapstone but once the metal starts glowing I don't see my mark anymore, it might just be my bad eyes. I can't read a speed limit sign at 30 yards, if I take my glasses off I don't even see the sign I've seen people use the centerpunch method and I guess it's time to give it a try.Try using typing correction fluid, if it's available where you are, a lot more visible than soapstone at a high heat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 I've heard of it used to keep from welding steel together in the fire before but never for marking. I'll try it if I can remember to pick some up one day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quarry Dog Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Keeping from welding something in the fire? That almost sounds like you don't have to try. If so I'm jealous and want to know the trick that makes it so simple for you In all sseriousness, I'll keep in mind that whiteout = no weld, and I'll also wonder at the application of such a finding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 Keeping from welding something in the fire? That almost sounds like you don't have to try. If so I'm jealous and want to know the trick that makes it so simple for you In all sseriousness, I'll keep in mind that whiteout = no weld, and I'll also wonder at the application of such a finding.i saw this in a YouTube video. The guy took a piece of square tubing and after welding a plug on the end coated the inside with whiteout. He then filled the tube with scrap bits of steel and some powdered HC steel. He put it in the fire and ended up welding up a pretty little billet that you peel the mild steel tubing off of. I think he was making pw knives like that. If I can remember when I get home from work I'll look and see if I can find it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Keeping from welding something in the fire? That almost sounds like you don't have to try. If so I'm jealous and want to know the trick that makes it so simple for you In all sseriousness, I'll keep in mind that whiteout = no weld, and I'll also wonder at the application of such a finding.It's a little protection from Mr. Murphy because sure as the junk fish will take your bait, the thing you do NOT want to weld will. Say the bosses of those tongs you've been working on for two days.Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quarry Dog Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 I can't even think how I'd manage to weld the bosses together, but that does sound like something I could manage, even forging them completely separately. I can see how peeling that can would be awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judson Yaggy Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 (edited) Keeping from welding something in the fire? That almost sounds like you don't have to try. If so I'm jealous and want to know the trick that makes it so simple for you In all sseriousness, I'll keep in mind that whiteout = no weld, and I'll also wonder at the application of such a finding.I've done production runs of architectural ironwork where there are stacks of laser cut pieces heating in the forge waiting for drawing or texturing and if the pieces are clean enough in a neutral fire they start to stick together if you don't work fast enough. Edited July 3, 2015 by Judson Yaggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 When I was forging the 2.5" sq, yard long, shaft for my stake anvil; we were using a propane forge at 7000' altitude and another smith sharing the forge repositioned their 3/4" piece and slid it up along the side of my piece and it welded such we had to sledge it off. No flux, no hammering; just heat mand clean metal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quarry Dog Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 That's just cool. I'm not bad at forge welding itself, but I have a hard time getting scarfs that I like. But I haven't had anything so "convenient" (or not) as two pieces welding of their own volition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 It was at the shop of a *very* professional smith and showed the temps he thought were appropriate for working at to make a living smithing! (Ribbon burner too) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted July 31, 2015 Author Share Posted July 31, 2015 QuarryDog, I just found the video I was referring to almost a month ago. J Nielson made the video showing whiteout used to keep from forge welding steel together. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZPgzGggQcc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quarry Dog Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Nifty trick. I'll have to remember that one. It just so happens I accidentally welded a really tight scroll onto itself a couple weeks ago...although, I'm not sure it counts as welding when you burn it that badly, even if it won't come apart for nothin'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted July 31, 2015 Author Share Posted July 31, 2015 We can call it welding this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwilson645 Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Nice work on the tongs, Mike. I haven't tried my hand at any since my wife bought me a set from Quick & Dirty for Christmas last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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