ausfire Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Not sure which forum to post this.Went looking for some axle steel and found this pile of buggy axles and car axles. The one that interests me is in the centre.It's a heavy cart axle (very old) and it has some interesting stampings on it.I would like to know what the 2 1/2 means. The axle is more than two and a half inches wide and it tapers. And what about the 10? 10 what? 10 ton capacity maybe.I also noticed the axle is stamped W.Gilpin and the word SCRAP. I believe Gilpin was a British company (Wedges Mills) producing mainly axes and hence the crossed axes under the numbers.I'm thinking I might drag this axle out and display it with other buggy gear, highlighting the stamping. Any ideas about the 2 1/2 and 10? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 can you make out anything along the top of the maker stamp Like "best"? I have seen things marked best scrap meaning that they were busheled from select wrought iron scrap and not whatever showed up. As for the numbers: if it doesn't refer to size in inches then I would *guess* it was a load rating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 You've got the greatest scrap pile in all of human history! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george m. Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 This is just a WAG but could the 10 refer to the axle being made for a 10" diameter hub (or a #10 hub)? I don't know how standardized hubs and axle cones were in the 19th century but it looks like something that would be unless every manufacturer made both axles and hubs to match. Speculatively, George M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 can you make out anything along the top of the maker stamp Like "best"?Thomas, it does look like something is written above the crest and it could well be 'best'. There is another of those stamps on the other end of the axle, so I will have a look and see if it's clearer there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 This is just a WAG but could the 10 refer to the axle being made for a 10" diameter hub (or a #10 hub)? I don't know how standardized hubs and axle cones were in the 19th century but it looks like something that would be unless every manufacturer made both axles and hubs to match. Speculatively,George M. That's a thought, George. Some of the hubs lying around look like about 10" across. And I did not think to measure the diameter of the stub axle on the end. Maybe that's the 2 1/2. Another look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 You've got the greatest scrap pile in all of human history! I have said before I am very fortunate to have such a supply of 'stuff'. I wish I had the skills to match it ... especially the big lumps of wrought.But apart from the usefulness of the 'scrap' I do like its historical significance and I admire the pride and artistry that the old time blacksmith worked into the products of his labour. I am thinking of putting together a display of these ... old hooks with the decorative finial points, buggy parts with the blacksmiths' touch marks, bullock dray chains marked 'genuine best', hand forged Condamine bells with "Good luck to Teamsters" stamped on them, that sort of thing. Worth preserving I reckon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teenylittlemetalguy Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Warning, controversial statement coming, look away if you are squeamish. If that was sitting in my shop I would cut off the awesome stamped chunks and use the rest... looks like a huge amount of good metal to me, whereas a worn out axle will still be a worn out axle in another 100 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted October 29, 2014 Author Share Posted October 29, 2014 Warning, controversial statement coming, look away if you are squeamish. If that was sitting in my shop I would cut off the awesome stamped chunks and use the rest... looks like a huge amount of good metal to me, whereas a worn out axle will still be a worn out axle in another 100 years. Well, I hope it will still be a worn out axle in another hundred years! The stamped parts make it a nice museum piece and worth keeping. I could easily find another fifty of these without any markings that could be cut up for whatever. I like the heavily pitted ones (bottom right in photo 1)that make attractive hat stands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 Had another look today with the added knowledge of a couple of experienced smiths. The most feasible explanation of the numbers appears to be related to the size of the stub axle. It would have a diameter of 2 1/2 inches tapering out 10 inches to the point where the hub is retained. The square section of axle adjacent to the stub would be the appropriate place to stamp the dimensions, I guess for the information of the wheelright. Sounds good to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Bill Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 What Vaughn said. Would most of this have come from England? I have exactly one buggy axle I've saved for projects; any idea of the carbon content in them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 What Vaughn said. Would most of this have come from England?I have exactly one buggy axle I've saved for projects; any idea of the carbon content in them? Yes, the Gilpin ones anyway. W. Gilpin, Wedges Mill, Cannock, UK. Started back in the 1830s - manufacturers of axles, cutting edge tools etc.I think most of those old Australian buggy axles would have come from England. Metal imported, coachwork here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forgemaster Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 When they are cut in half or broken in half as some are found they make a pretty good anvil, with a flat face, a kind of a heel and a horn/bick. They just need some sort of a base welding onto them and they need that washer up where the transition from round taper to rect is taking off. I'm talking here about the big axle, not the little sulky ones. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yahoo2 Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 If it is a load rating it is likely to be 10 CWT (hundredweight) 11200 pounds or 5 ton. I have seen some other things stamped with CWT but cant for the life of me think what they are....umm ....no, oh well, back to the anvil. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted November 9, 2014 Author Share Posted November 9, 2014 Yahoo 2, your maths is a bit off the mark there mate. 10 cwt is only half a ton. And that axle would hold a lot more than that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yahoo2 Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Yep, another brain fade. I will describe your photos to a friend when I see him next. It will be at least three weeks before we catch up, I am flat out with the grain harvest at the moment. He cant see much but he's pretty good on model numbers and what parts fit which machines for English imported stuff from the early 1900's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iron woodrow Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 darryl, i just checked an axle i have in my pile of the same size, the effective taper (the bit between the boss and the hole for the wedge) is exactly 10 inches, and the diameter of the widest part of the taper is exactly 2 1/2 inches it is stamped RIGBY LONDON 10 2 1/2 dunno about you, but that settles it for me ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted November 10, 2014 Author Share Posted November 10, 2014 darryl, i just checked an axle i have in my pile of the same size, the effective taper (the bit between the boss and the hole for the wedge) is exactly 10 inches, and the diameter of the widest part of the taper is exactly 2 1/2 inchesit is stamped RIGBY LONDON 10 2 1/2 dunno about you, but that settles it for me ;) Yep, me too. We've nailed it. Since we measured that one, I've been setting up a display of about 40 of those axles that are in reasonable condition - some heavy dray axles and some of the lighter sulky axles. I found another Gilpin one, clearly stamped with the crossed axes and the numbers 10 and 2 1/4. And they correspond exactly to the inner diameter and length of the stub axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iron woodrow Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 swap you an unmarked one for my rigby london one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted November 11, 2014 Author Share Posted November 11, 2014 swap you an unmarked one for my rigby london one? Done. Sounds like a good deal to me. I have an unmarked (very heavy) wrought iron one that might interest you. You'll need more than your motorcycle to get it home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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