28 replies to this topic

[Paddy]

Dear All,

I am in need of making a small hand held (top) flatter. Hand held, about 1 1/4" - 1 1/2" square. Ideally, something like a peddinhaus design for use with me and a 3 lb hammer. I'm using it to flatten bar stock (shoe making), and certain decorative pieces for efficiency and speed.

I would like to know what actual grade of steels are best suited for use as a flatter i.e. 10..??. How to work it.

I've got an own made tool at the moment, made from standard 1" square mild steel (A35). A nice tool, but its mushrooming alot. I hardened the flatter side (usual plunge end into water to feeze it) and the flatter side is OK, but the hammer side quickly demised.

Process - by upsetting one end, then slightly draw out edges over off side. Slit punch or drill hole for wooden handle or round stock.

Do not possess a power hammer, or a swage block, so its down to tongs and a 3lb hammer to sort this one out. I could spend the $120 on just buying one, but that seems way too easy.

Many thanks.

[Frank Turley]

Since flatters are not made for edge holding, a medium carbon steel such as an old axle half-shaft would work. The ones about 15 years old and older are often 1045. You can harden the business end in water. To temper, bury the striking head in a coke fire and look for a purple or blue temper color to appear on the scale-free working face.

My hammer eye punches with haft are the kind that remove a burr. I don't slit/drift, although some smiths do. I punch/druft. The eye is "capsule shaped," with straight sides and half-round ends. I suppose you could upset to get the flange. It will take several heats.

You should expect some mushrooming on the striking head, because it is always softer than the hammer head for reasons of safety. It will be normalized or annealed.

http://www.turleyforge.com Granddaddy of Blacksmith Schools

[Wesley Chambers]

PADDY!! You old dog! how ya been mate! Just use a hunk o'rail like I did! hahah

[rthibeau]

I use 1045 steel, 2 1/2 inch square, heat treat like Frank said. An easy flatter could have a wire wrap handle made of 1/4" round mild steel to avoid the work of punching/slitting the eye for a wood handle. Cut or grind off the excess for the top part to be struck with a hammer. Any medium carbon steel with a flat end can be used, looks is secondary to function.

[HWooldridge]

I use old air chisel shanks. Cut off one end flush to the collar, polish and you have a ready-made face. No post forging HT necessary. Either punch an eye for a wooden handle or wrap with a piece of steel rod.

I have several of these floating around the shop and they work well.

[Sask Mark]

rthibeau, on 01 September 2010 - 11:36 AM, said:

I use 1045 steel, 2 1/2 inch square, heat treat like Frank said. An easy flatter could have a wire wrap handle made of 1/4" round mild steel to avoid the work of punching/slitting the eye for a wood handle. Cut or grind off the excess for the top part to be struck with a hammer. Any medium carbon steel with a flat end can be used, looks is secondary to function.

Mr. Thibeau, those are some lovely looking flatters that have been recently added to your gallery.

[arftist]

rthibeau, on 01 September 2010 - 11:36 AM, said:

I use 1045 steel, 2 1/2 inch square, heat treat like Frank said. An easy flatter could have a wire wrap handle made of 1/4" round mild steel to avoid the work of punching/slitting the eye for a wood handle. Cut or grind off the excess for the top part to be struck with a hammer. Any medium carbon steel with a flat end can be used, looks is secondary to function.

Please allow me to also comment on your flatters. Very clever! Simple, clean and funtional.

[Paddy]

Many thanks everybody.

1045 it is. And I'll try to stamp a hole, Should be a bit more easy than my slit punch, as I'm on my own.


Marauding Scrap man came round today and I obtained a 3/4 full sheet of 1/8" diamond pattern for $20. His antequated beatun up van is definitely something off Mad Max!. I'll ask about old axles next time I see him. He has access to many a pile of cheap gold.


Wesley - Am doing fine. I've got a website paddysforge.com. Drop me an email. Got a handful customers on the horses also, not quite the 100 yet!.

Cheers,

paddy

[Paddy]

Mr Thibeau,

Many thanks for your advice. Your flatters look very nice. Mine will be somewhat basic functional as you say. Which will do. I'll do a wire handle one aswell.

Thnaks

paddy

[Frosty]

Nice looking hammers you have there Richard.

Axle stock is usually pretty easy to find and forgiving of inexpert heat treating.

I only have one thing to add that hasn't already been said and that's a way to dress the struck end of top tools. The most common problems being mushrooming chipping. Chipping can occur if the struck end becomes mushroomed as well as if it's too hard.

An easy way to avoid both is use only a mild steel hammer on your top tools and leave the struck face of the top tool a little harder. Another method and one I prefer simply because you can never guarantee someone else might not strike it with a hardened hammer. Oh yeah, the method is to chamfer and radius the struck face. This concentrates the energy from the hammer in the center of the struck face where it has lots of meat around the impact site to prevent deformation. I chamfer and radius all my struck tools except the wood chisels that never see a steel hammer.

Frosty the Lucky.

[ironstein]

I will second what has been said Rthibeau, nice looking tools in the gallery. If you don't mind, were those just square stock forged down to round where the eye is formed?

[Charles R. Stevens]

What we call Ag steel especialy the square axles from disk harrows works well as it is shock resistant. I also use the large square bars from load leveling hitches for hammer like tools. I use rounded struck ends and soft faced hammers.

[rthibeau]

ironstein.....the flatters were 1045 steel 2 1/2" square bar.....while at trying_it's hammer-in, they were cut to length, milled flat and square, turned on a lathe, and the eye was machined....then they were heat treated. Oh yeah, for smaller flatters, railroad track bolts have been suggested....grind the head smooth and wrap a wire handle around it and there you go.

[Wesley Chambers]

I needed one quick and dirty, had 8' of rr track so this fatty was born heheh took all of 15 min to toss together, lopping off sides with the bandsaw and such prolly weighs about 2# but it gets the job done in a hurry, was "borrowed" a number of times to run some draft shoes flat but I use it on just about everything

 RRflatter.jpg   52.64K   92 downloads

[rthibeau]

Good use of available steel, Wesley.......best thing about blacksmithing, you can make it up as you go along.....

[Paddy]

Gentlemen,

I made the flatter. Got some 1040, they didn't have 1045 (alro), some 1 1/2" round, they has 2 1.2 round also - good for bottom tools ????..

I put the round in the fcoke orge, picked it up, hit it a few times. Came to conclusion to square one end quickly (after 3 upsets), and it drew out beautifully. Hardened (flat end quench) and tempered (hammer end to blue temper then dip) . Bit of grinder work to lay in the handle guides. 1/4" round stock handle twisted nicely. And the end produt is defintley useable.

Cost $3 for the 1040 (2 3/4" of round 1 1/2"),

Job done.

Basic but functional.

Many thanks,

Paddy Falvey
paddysforge.com

[Dodge]

Paddy, on 03 September 2010 - 04:25 PM, said:

Gentlemen,

I made the flatter. Got some 1040, they didn't have 1045 (alro), some 1 1/2" round, they has 2 1.2 round also - good for bottom tools ????..

I put the round in the fcoke orge, picked it up, hit it a few times. Came to conclusion to square one end quickly (after 3 upsets), and it drew out beautifully. Hardened (flat end quench) and tempered (hammer end to blue temper then dip) . Bit of grinder work to lay in the handle guides. 1/4" round stock handle twisted nicely. And the end produt is defintley useable.

Cost $3 for the 1040 (2 3/4" of round 1 1/2"),

Job done.

Basic but functional.

Many thanks,

Paddy Falvey
paddysforge.com

Pictures, Paddy! We must have pictures!!

[Wesley Chambers]

Dodge, on 03 September 2010 - 04:50 PM, said:

Pictures, Paddy! We must have pictures!!

Careful what you wish for, through school I think Paddy was the only one with a camera out more than myself!

[rthibeau]

IFI Shop Rules....you talk about something you made, you must show pics.....we like to gawk ya know....

[Paddy]

Pictures - I will be back in my forge Tuesday. Will get a picture up. Am away at horse event this weekend.