Joinery

[primtechsmith]

What are some tips for those trying different methods of joinery like collaring, and riveting?

Peyton

[Ed Thomas]

Peyton: Learning joinery in iron is no different than learning it in woodworking. You study examples, both live and in books. You watch demonstrators and you go to classes. Not only is there an enormous arsenal of options in classic joinery, but modern artesans have been exploiting new architecture and innovative methods.

Go to the National Cathedral in Washington DC and spend a day just studying how the ironwork is put together. Buy books that illustrate joinery techniques you would like to master.

Find a master and ask them to show you something SPECIFIC. Don't just ask: "Show me how to do joinery". That is too vague. It also takes a lot of effort and practice on your part, so don't waste his time if you haven't done your homework. Instead, ask things such as: "How do I make a square tenon?" "How do I properly fit that tenon?" "When is it appropriate to use one?"

If you are really serious, there are one-week classes every year at almost every blacksmithing school in the country. Pick one near you and fork out the money.

If you have a particular question involving joinery, ask away.

[primtechsmith]

Being vague was exactly the point here. Open ended questions with a broad topic usually facilitate more traffic and responses on many different levels and aspects of the subject at hand. We have among us here on this forum many smiths who have a wealth of knowledge. This forum is an interactive book of sorts with many resources, authors, and editors. I am merely attempting to create a thread to expand the knowledge of us all...I am just trying to do my part to further this forum.

Peyton

[GobblerForge]

I like using joinery. Mortice and tennon are ornimental as well very strong. Tips would be to use good shoulders on the tennon and extend the tennon one and a half times it's thickness. This gives good material for riveting it back. Same goes for rivets. Collars work well when applied hot so as to shrink tight. They work well for covering welds too. Tips would be to cut the collar total circumference + one and a half the thichness of the collar material. Chamfer both ends of the collar so they overlap. This gives a little fudge factor that a butt end doesn't. Any thing else?
Gobbler

[JWBIRONWORKS]

PrimeTech,
Your questions and the insight and knowledge they have drawn out of the members here is appreciated by all. We can all learn new or diffrent ways to accomplish a goal. If nothing else a person may be reminded of something forgotten in the shuffle. Please continue with your line of threads.

JWB

[Ed Thomas]

Peyton: Whole books are (and rightfully should be) written about this topic. I have no idea where to start in answering such a question. As I heard someone say: "Learn the trade, not the tricks". I don't mean that in any way to be disparaging, but rather to point out that joinery goes right to the heart of blacksmithing. It is everything. The more I learn about the mechanical joining of iron, and the ornamentation of the joining, the better my forging becomes. We are blacksmiths largely because of our love of joinery itself!

Joinery allows us to make manageable discrete parts, and join them in mechanically sound, esthetically pleasing ways. It makes no sense to forge an entire stair railing from one piece, though I suppose it could be done. Instead, we draw the entire railing, and then study it to see what individual components are needed to make it become the drawing. Then we make choices about how to combine those pieces elegantly. That is the joinery.

Almost all of the arguments about the validity of welding (forge or arc) versus mechanical joining are disagreements about the importance of the point of union... the joint... to the whole. The more importance you place on that point, the more likely you are to search for ways to make it beautiful and harmonious with the rest of the forging. Many of us find the mechanical joins to be opportunities for beauty of the highest order in forging. It is our love of making ornamental functional joins that gets us in trouble with those who ascribe little or no importance to the esthetic value of that spot.

All elaborate, beautiful, complex ironwork is made up of lots of simple (or at least "simpler") pieces... which are joined in such a way as to contribute to its beauty and its wholeness.

That's why I don't quite know what to do with your question. Its so darn big.

[Strine]

Wow! So elegantly put...a masterly insight into the craft. Thankyou Ed for the inspiration.

[Strine]

Only recently I was asked about my intensions as to why I was studying the Governmant House gates from a few inches away when 'normal' people look at them from afar, take a photo and nick off. When you study a gate from that close it sure doesn't appear that you're looking at the gate but rather what's beyond. In the end the security guard, who appeared from his hidey hole, took a keen interest in the finer points of his charge and we had a great old yarn.

[ThomasPowers]

So how many of you have used a deep well socket as a monkey tool to chean up a tennon shoulder?

Thomas

[Ed Thomas]

Strine: Thanks for appreciating the perspective. I remember the first time I saw the ironwork in the Washington National Cathedral. Very briefly I forgot I was in a church and thought I was in heaven.